1 00:00:05,000 --> 00:00:15,000 2 00:00:05,000 --> 00:00:15,000 3 00:00:57,125 --> 00:01:01,541 [beep] [voicemail] Tuesday, 9:47 am 4 00:01:01,541 --> 00:01:05,083 [female] Hi, honey. I-- baby, you have to listen 5 00:01:01,541 --> 00:01:05,083 to me carefully. 6 00:01:05,083 --> 00:01:07,666 I am on a plane that has been hijacked. 7 00:01:05,083 --> 00:01:07,666 I am on a plane. 8 00:01:07,666 --> 00:01:10,333 I call from the plane. I want to tell you I love you. 9 00:01:10,333 --> 00:01:13,791 Please tell my children that I really love them. 10 00:01:13,791 --> 00:01:16,166 And I'm very sorry, honey. 11 00:01:16,166 --> 00:01:18,791 I don't know what to say. There are three people. 12 00:01:18,791 --> 00:01:21,333 They have hijacked the plane. I try to calm down. 13 00:01:21,333 --> 00:01:24,333 We turn around, and I've heard it 14 00:01:21,333 --> 00:01:24,333 there are planes 15 00:01:24,333 --> 00:01:27,250 which has been flown to the world trade center. 16 00:01:27,250 --> 00:01:30,791 I hope to see your face again, honey. 17 00:01:30,791 --> 00:01:33,166 I love you. Goodbye. 18 00:01:40,333 --> 00:01:42,625 Voicemail: End of message. 19 00:01:47,166 --> 00:01:49,916 Well, the picture I saw, which, of course, uh, 20 00:01:49,916 --> 00:01:55,791 The most influencing me is the people who dive from the building 21 00:01:49,916 --> 00:01:55,791 when burning. 22 00:01:55,791 --> 00:01:59,291 You know, to be put in such a desperate state, you know, 23 00:01:59,291 --> 00:02:02,250 which shows you are human-- 24 00:02:02,250 --> 00:02:06,875 human reaction to such conditions. 25 00:02:06,875 --> 00:02:10,208 That's just, uh, it's just rebelling. 26 00:02:12,875 --> 00:02:17,000 And disgusting that we let it, basically, happen. 27 00:02:22,125 --> 00:02:24,125 ThinThread is a program 28 00:02:24,125 --> 00:02:27,458 which will definitely prevent 9/11. 29 00:02:30,416 --> 00:02:32,750 So everything goes back to the program. 30 00:03:44,125 --> 00:03:46,916 [Radack] First time 31 00:03:44,125 --> 00:03:46,916 I met Bill Binney, 32 00:03:46,916 --> 00:03:50,166 the first thing he said to me was, 33 00:03:50,166 --> 00:03:56,000 "I want you to know that I will never intentionally 34 00:03:50,166 --> 00:03:56,000 kill myself." 35 00:04:00,375 --> 00:04:03,666 I think he's a little overdramatic, 36 00:04:03,666 --> 00:04:06,958 but then when I start hearing what he says 37 00:04:06,958 --> 00:04:09,166 about what our country does, 38 00:04:09,166 --> 00:04:13,750 I am worried about his safety too. 39 00:04:13,750 --> 00:04:17,000 [Binney] I want to make one thing 40 00:04:13,750 --> 00:04:17,000 very sure ahead, 41 00:04:17,000 --> 00:04:21,541 that he can be convinced that I will not commit suicide. 42 00:04:21,541 --> 00:04:24,625 And I say that because I know that some people are involved 43 00:04:21,541 --> 00:04:24,625 in this activity, 44 00:04:24,625 --> 00:04:27,041 and that is a very serious thing 45 00:04:27,041 --> 00:04:29,041 because people at the highest level 46 00:04:29,041 --> 00:04:31,041 from the US government involved 47 00:04:31,041 --> 00:04:33,958 in all departments. 48 00:04:33,958 --> 00:04:36,458 So I want to make sure that he understands 49 00:04:36,458 --> 00:04:39,750 that if something happens to me, it's not suicide 50 00:04:39,750 --> 00:04:41,875 because I will be here with him 51 00:04:41,875 --> 00:04:44,125 and others to the end. 52 00:05:31,458 --> 00:05:34,541 I grew up in midwestern Pennsylvania. 53 00:05:34,541 --> 00:05:37,125 That is basically the Pennsylvania wilderness. 54 00:05:37,125 --> 00:05:40,416 It's in the hills, in the hills of Appalachia 55 00:05:40,416 --> 00:05:42,833 right before the mountains. 56 00:06:38,166 --> 00:06:40,416 This is my father's grave. 57 00:06:43,833 --> 00:06:45,875 At one time, I asked him, I said, uh, 58 00:06:45,875 --> 00:06:50,541 "In your service during the war, how many men did you kill?" 59 00:06:50,541 --> 00:06:53,416 And she said, "maybe one." 60 00:06:53,416 --> 00:06:55,125 So that's all he said. 61 00:06:55,125 --> 00:06:57,458 He doesn't really talk about it. 62 00:07:01,166 --> 00:07:04,833 I think it's very typical of World War II veterans. 63 00:07:04,833 --> 00:07:07,250 They do what they have to do and they don't really do it 64 00:07:07,250 --> 00:07:11,875 think that it's different from the others 65 00:07:07,250 --> 00:07:11,875 in World War II. 66 00:07:13,875 --> 00:07:17,000 Nobody thought they were heroes. They just think so 67 00:07:13,875 --> 00:07:17,000 their task. 68 00:07:19,166 --> 00:07:22,166 One of the worst things about war is that they start it 69 00:07:22,166 --> 00:07:25,666 Forcing others to be as cruel as them to stop it. 70 00:07:25,666 --> 00:07:27,500 That's what I'm sure he feels. 71 00:07:27,500 --> 00:07:29,500 He just doesn't want to talk about having to do 72 00:07:29,500 --> 00:07:31,666 what should he do when in war. 73 00:07:34,291 --> 00:07:38,125 One of the main reasons we fight is due to mistakes 74 00:07:34,291 --> 00:07:38,125 by leadership 75 00:07:38,125 --> 00:07:40,083 because they are given incorrect information 76 00:07:40,083 --> 00:07:43,083 or they are uniformed about the event, you know, fully. 77 00:07:43,083 --> 00:07:46,458 So my principle is that I work under 78 00:07:46,458 --> 00:07:48,125 is ensuring that information 79 00:07:48,125 --> 00:07:51,208 that I can arrive through the work I do 80 00:07:51,208 --> 00:07:55,083 informative for leadership so they don't make mistakes. 81 00:08:17,333 --> 00:08:19,916 [woman] Watch out, be careful. 82 00:08:27,083 --> 00:08:30,250 Back now for you once again if you just joined us, 83 00:08:30,250 --> 00:08:32,625 an underground explosion in the garage section 84 00:08:32,625 --> 00:08:34,958 from the World Trade Center in New York City 85 00:08:34,958 --> 00:08:38,250 now has killed three people according to New York 86 00:08:34,958 --> 00:08:38,250 Port Authority 87 00:08:38,250 --> 00:08:40,875 and has injured at least 150 people. 88 00:08:40,875 --> 00:08:43,333 Hundreds of people when we talk are still being evacuated 89 00:08:43,333 --> 00:08:45,541 from the twin story structure structure 90 00:08:45,541 --> 00:08:49,833 at the southern end of Manhattan Island. 91 00:08:49,833 --> 00:08:51,791 There is no hope at all. 92 00:08:51,791 --> 00:08:53,958 Stuck on the 94th floor along the way. 93 00:08:53,958 --> 00:08:57,500 The walls explode and everything goes blank 94 00:08:53,958 --> 00:08:57,500 after that. 95 00:08:57,500 --> 00:09:00,208 The wall collapses, the furniture goes down. 96 00:09:00,208 --> 00:09:02,750 It's a mess downstairs. 97 00:09:02,750 --> 00:09:06,041 [Binney] The first attack 98 00:09:02,750 --> 00:09:06,041 at the Trade Center on & 93; 99 00:09:06,041 --> 00:09:08,500 that is the first thing that wakes everyone 100 00:09:08,500 --> 00:09:11,708 in the case of terrorism threats. 101 00:09:21,291 --> 00:09:23,541 They carry truck bombs to the basement 102 00:09:23,541 --> 00:09:27,708 and try to place a bomb next to supporters 103 00:09:23,541 --> 00:09:27,708 for the building 104 00:09:27,708 --> 00:09:29,875 and set it to try to shake the building 105 00:09:29,875 --> 00:09:32,500 or destroy support so the building will fall. 106 00:09:35,250 --> 00:09:37,458 Technically, it doesn't work like that, 107 00:09:37,458 --> 00:09:40,250 but it kills a lot of people, 108 00:09:40,250 --> 00:09:43,375 and the CIA really starts hitting drums 109 00:09:43,375 --> 00:09:47,666 in the entire intelligence community 110 00:09:43,375 --> 00:09:47,666 to pursue terrorism, 111 00:09:47,666 --> 00:09:50,125 and that's what we did at the NSA. 112 00:10:13,291 --> 00:10:14,958 We also search at the same time 113 00:10:14,958 --> 00:10:17,041 with an explosion in the digital era, 114 00:10:17,041 --> 00:10:19,875 bend communication on the internet and telephone, 115 00:10:19,875 --> 00:10:23,000 and the terrorists bury themselves inside 116 00:10:23,000 --> 00:10:26,500 communication networks that swell around the world. 117 00:10:31,625 --> 00:10:35,000 So we have to face that as a new technical problem 118 00:10:35,000 --> 00:10:37,041 that we have to solve to find out 119 00:10:37,041 --> 00:10:39,375 who communicates with who and who is the terrorist 120 00:10:39,375 --> 00:10:43,916 and try extracting that information from that stream 121 00:10:39,375 --> 00:10:43,916 information. 122 00:11:02,333 --> 00:11:05,208 When I first took on the duties of technical director 123 00:11:05,208 --> 00:11:08,458 world geopolitical and military analysis 124 00:11:05,208 --> 00:11:08,458 and report the store, 125 00:11:08,458 --> 00:11:13,041 I gather analysts from all agencies 126 00:11:08,458 --> 00:11:13,041 around the world... 127 00:11:15,291 --> 00:11:17,541 And I said, "okay, we will start 128 00:11:15,291 --> 00:11:17,541 this small project here, 129 00:11:17,541 --> 00:11:21,666 and this is what we will do. 130 00:11:21,666 --> 00:11:23,458 We will graph relationships 131 00:11:23,458 --> 00:11:26,208 everyone on the telephone network in the world. 132 00:11:30,250 --> 00:11:32,125 All we have to do is map all the relations 133 00:11:32,125 --> 00:11:34,500 between two and a half billion cellphones. " 134 00:11:38,625 --> 00:11:42,500 And someone behind said, "You can't do that." 135 00:11:42,500 --> 00:11:44,458 And I say, "why not?" 136 00:11:44,458 --> 00:11:47,500 And they say, "because all combinations are unlimited." 137 00:11:51,125 --> 00:11:54,166 So I said, "okay, think about this method. 138 00:11:56,750 --> 00:12:01,000 At each instant point of time 139 00:12:01,000 --> 00:12:04,916 the number of atoms in the universe is limited. 140 00:12:10,083 --> 00:12:12,125 Relation to 2.5 billion phones 141 00:12:12,125 --> 00:12:15,458 is only a subset smaller than that. 142 00:12:15,458 --> 00:12:17,000 Nothing. 143 00:12:19,416 --> 00:12:21,333 Now you can get your mind around it. 144 00:12:25,958 --> 00:12:28,666 That is the overall idea of the ThinThread program. 145 00:12:37,166 --> 00:12:41,458 [Wiebe] Of all the analysts I have ever known 146 00:12:41,458 --> 00:12:45,583 throughout my career, starting from the US air force 147 00:12:45,583 --> 00:12:47,791 through my career at NSA, 148 00:12:47,791 --> 00:12:53,541 Bill is by far the smartest, 149 00:12:53,541 --> 00:12:56,625 the most capable, 150 00:12:56,625 --> 00:12:58,166 right. 151 00:13:00,333 --> 00:13:03,125 He uses all the necessary tools, 152 00:13:03,125 --> 00:13:05,750 not only to find the story, 153 00:13:05,750 --> 00:13:08,166 but to solve it. 154 00:13:10,500 --> 00:13:16,083 Where we can't really read the message, 155 00:13:16,083 --> 00:13:18,041 they are encrypted, 156 00:13:18,041 --> 00:13:23,708 Bill finds a way to utilize the 157 00:13:23,708 --> 00:13:27,208 indicator that I never saw someone else do it. 158 00:13:27,208 --> 00:13:30,791 Bill is Mr. Externals at NSA. 159 00:13:30,791 --> 00:13:33,875 He is a person at his agency 160 00:13:33,875 --> 00:13:36,791 who knows best about what we now call 161 00:13:36,791 --> 00:13:38,958 in the digital era, metadata. 162 00:13:44,541 --> 00:13:47,541 If something is encrypted and you can't decrypt it, 163 00:13:47,541 --> 00:13:51,125 You can still get information from an external signal, 164 00:13:51,125 --> 00:13:53,458 and that is Bill's expertise. 165 00:13:58,083 --> 00:14:01,875 Bill will find a way to encrypt 166 00:14:01,875 --> 00:14:05,500 to see things that people don't even look for... 167 00:14:08,000 --> 00:14:10,791 Able to work almost all problems, 168 00:14:10,791 --> 00:14:12,833 almost all challenges, 169 00:14:12,833 --> 00:14:14,750 and use mathematics 170 00:14:14,750 --> 00:14:18,333 and other inherent analytical skills 171 00:14:18,333 --> 00:14:20,625 and desire to be open-minded, 172 00:14:20,625 --> 00:14:23,291 not closed minded. 173 00:14:23,291 --> 00:14:25,250 He has a B.S. detector 174 00:14:25,250 --> 00:14:30,250 and he can know when someone blows smoke. 175 00:14:30,250 --> 00:14:35,375 And he is the agency 176 00:14:35,375 --> 00:14:39,583 best traffic analyst, no bar. 177 00:15:07,416 --> 00:15:10,000 [Binney] At 65 65, I came out 178 00:15:07,416 --> 00:15:10,000 school 179 00:15:10,000 --> 00:15:12,666 and the Vietnam war began to rampage. 180 00:15:17,041 --> 00:15:19,083 That's when we still have a draft, 181 00:15:19,083 --> 00:15:23,125 so people start to be spread from my community. 182 00:15:24,083 --> 00:15:25,666 And because in the country, 183 00:15:25,666 --> 00:15:28,291 You are usually pretty good with a shotgun, 184 00:15:28,291 --> 00:15:31,125 and if you go to the army, you end up at the front line 185 00:15:31,125 --> 00:15:34,333 do sweep through forests in Vietnam 186 00:15:34,333 --> 00:15:36,458 and shoot people... 187 00:15:41,416 --> 00:15:45,875 I really don't want to participate in all of that 188 00:15:41,416 --> 00:15:45,875 at all. 189 00:15:48,166 --> 00:15:51,625 I even stopped hunting because I didn't like killing animals. 190 00:15:53,708 --> 00:15:57,375 So why do I want to be involved with Vietnam? 191 00:15:59,916 --> 00:16:03,500 I have the option to volunteer for the army to go to Europe. 192 00:16:03,500 --> 00:16:05,708 They gave me the entire battery test, 193 00:16:05,708 --> 00:16:09,708 and they say, "Wow, you have a high enough talent 194 00:16:05,708 --> 00:16:09,708 for analysis." 195 00:16:09,708 --> 00:16:11,500 So they say, "Hey, you are the prime candidate 196 00:16:11,500 --> 00:16:13,541 for military security agencies," 197 00:16:13,541 --> 00:16:16,416 and they sent me to Turkey. 198 00:16:31,000 --> 00:16:35,541 We just passed the Cuban Missile Crisis 199 00:16:31,000 --> 00:16:35,541 in 1962, 200 00:16:35,541 --> 00:16:37,375 which is probably the closest time 201 00:16:37,375 --> 00:16:39,500 we have ever come to nuclear war, 202 00:16:39,500 --> 00:16:44,041 and the type of sensitivity of each person to real threats. 203 00:16:44,041 --> 00:16:46,916 Turkey is looking at the south 204 00:16:44,041 --> 00:16:46,916 from the Soviet Union. 205 00:16:46,916 --> 00:16:50,541 They have many areas where they are developing 206 00:16:46,916 --> 00:16:50,541 military technology. 207 00:16:52,458 --> 00:16:56,000 I work a rather large military data system, 208 00:16:56,000 --> 00:17:01,083 Soviet data system, unresolved 209 00:16:56,000 --> 00:17:01,083 at that time. 210 00:17:03,541 --> 00:17:06,000 So they will see things like Morse manual 211 00:17:06,000 --> 00:17:10,125 or broadcast speech or satellite communication. 212 00:17:12,041 --> 00:17:14,541 Such things produce information 213 00:17:14,541 --> 00:17:18,583 they call traffic. 214 00:17:18,583 --> 00:17:22,583 Some of you will record, some of which you will also record 215 00:17:18,583 --> 00:17:22,583 directly translated 216 00:17:22,583 --> 00:17:25,625 or converted to character flow. 217 00:17:27,416 --> 00:17:29,916 Some will continue to be encrypted data, 218 00:17:29,916 --> 00:17:31,833 that you won't be able to read, 219 00:17:31,833 --> 00:17:34,625 but you can see the duration and things like that. 220 00:17:34,625 --> 00:17:39,208 That's probably 20 Russian military, 221 00:17:39,208 --> 00:17:41,375 so I see the small segment 222 00:17:41,375 --> 00:17:43,833 trying to develop the techniques needed 223 00:17:43,833 --> 00:17:46,166 to see what they do. 224 00:17:53,083 --> 00:17:56,625 That I sat at the table, looking at this abstract data, 225 00:17:56,625 --> 00:17:59,708 struggling to understand what that means. 226 00:18:11,041 --> 00:18:13,333 When I go there, it becomes clear to me 227 00:18:13,333 --> 00:18:16,416 that there are mathematical patterns involved. 228 00:18:19,958 --> 00:18:22,375 I started seeing systems and relationships, 229 00:18:22,375 --> 00:18:25,375 so I started building something. 230 00:18:25,375 --> 00:18:29,041 That allows me to then begin to understand and interpret 231 00:18:29,041 --> 00:18:32,458 the things we get in terms of communication... 232 00:18:35,291 --> 00:18:38,000 And connect it to real-world events 233 00:18:38,000 --> 00:18:40,583 and what actually happens in the field. 234 00:18:46,000 --> 00:18:49,291 When I arrived at that point, everything started 235 00:18:46,000 --> 00:18:49,291 to fall into place 236 00:18:49,291 --> 00:18:52,208 and then you can reconstruct the entire system, 237 00:18:52,208 --> 00:18:54,916 their entire command and control system 238 00:18:54,916 --> 00:18:57,375 and everything they do. 239 00:19:08,500 --> 00:19:11,958 Everything is human behavior. 240 00:19:11,958 --> 00:19:14,666 Human behavior is very patterned. 241 00:19:16,000 --> 00:19:18,416 How do people operate? How do they interact? 242 00:19:18,416 --> 00:19:20,541 And how it manifests or appears 243 00:19:20,541 --> 00:19:24,541 in this abstract communication series 244 00:19:20,541 --> 00:19:24,541 Are you looking? 245 00:19:26,875 --> 00:19:30,541 This problem reaches the point where you can 246 00:19:26,875 --> 00:19:30,541 understand the pattern 247 00:19:30,541 --> 00:19:32,833 and interpret it correctly. 248 00:19:38,250 --> 00:19:40,250 When you sit there and see a problem like that 249 00:19:40,250 --> 00:19:45,875 and you see-- You can see patterns and pauses, 250 00:19:45,875 --> 00:19:47,833 it's fun when you do it. 251 00:19:47,833 --> 00:19:49,666 That's right. 252 00:19:52,208 --> 00:19:56,125 Which is basically what we call metadata analysis now. 253 00:19:57,291 --> 00:19:59,541 Looks like nobody did that. 254 00:20:02,458 --> 00:20:05,958 So finally the NSA asked me to be reassigned 255 00:20:05,958 --> 00:20:08,291 to NSA headquarters. 256 00:20:08,291 --> 00:20:14,833 I got a letter from what we called "God" 257 00:20:08,291 --> 00:20:14,833 in February of the year & apos; 67. 258 00:20:37,291 --> 00:20:41,375 [Loomis] Metadata is actually just data 259 00:20:37,291 --> 00:20:41,375 about data. 260 00:20:43,125 --> 00:20:47,291 And as a traffic analyst, 261 00:20:47,291 --> 00:20:51,500 You don't care about what's in the conversation. 262 00:20:51,500 --> 00:20:54,000 You care who speaks with whom, 263 00:20:54,000 --> 00:20:57,416 how often they talk, when they speak, 264 00:20:57,416 --> 00:20:59,708 what are their speech patterns, 265 00:20:59,708 --> 00:21:01,958 who they are talking to, 266 00:21:01,958 --> 00:21:03,500 who they are talking to, 267 00:21:03,500 --> 00:21:05,375 what is subordinated, 268 00:21:05,375 --> 00:21:09,125 organizational command and control structure? 269 00:21:15,250 --> 00:21:17,666 [Binney] In May & apos; 68, 270 00:21:15,250 --> 00:21:17,666 I was moved 271 00:21:17,666 --> 00:21:20,791 to the current reporting store. 272 00:21:20,791 --> 00:21:24,875 Early in the summer, the Russians began practicing 273 00:21:24,875 --> 00:21:28,333 or exercise along the border of Czechoslovakia. 274 00:21:32,041 --> 00:21:34,541 I began to see communication 275 00:21:34,541 --> 00:21:36,500 they use to move. 276 00:21:38,708 --> 00:21:40,291 And that's where I started choosing 277 00:21:40,291 --> 00:21:42,708 some very small unique things 278 00:21:42,708 --> 00:21:46,291 it's different from a normal training program. 279 00:21:49,458 --> 00:21:52,041 So I started to catch it. 280 00:21:55,000 --> 00:21:59,250 And I said, "it's clear that they will invade." 281 00:22:05,333 --> 00:22:08,416 Just two days later they actually invaded. 282 00:22:16,250 --> 00:22:19,000 That was the first incident I had 283 00:22:19,000 --> 00:22:22,875 direct personal experience with real-world activities which let me see what's different between that 284 00:22:22,875 --> 00:22:27,500 and training. 285 00:22:22,875 --> 00:22:27,500 286 00:22:34,958 --> 00:22:40,458 That gives me an idea of what is a real warning indicator 287 00:22:34,958 --> 00:22:40,458 upcoming action. 288 00:22:44,166 --> 00:22:47,333 Real warning indicators, there are only five. 289 00:22:47,333 --> 00:22:50,416 Five, that's all. Only five warning indicators. 290 00:22:50,416 --> 00:22:54,208 I mean, they might have a hundred warning indicators 291 00:22:50,416 --> 00:22:54,208 in the list, 292 00:22:54,208 --> 00:22:56,166 but none of them means anything. 293 00:22:56,166 --> 00:22:59,041 Five real ones are not even in the list. 294 00:22:59,041 --> 00:23:01,666 Okay, so I have five of me 295 00:23:01,666 --> 00:23:03,541 and the rest doesn't mean to me. 296 00:23:03,541 --> 00:23:05,708 So I only pay attention to those five people. 297 00:23:05,708 --> 00:23:09,958 And that's only case by case from time to time, for decades, 298 00:23:09,958 --> 00:23:12,916 You can see every time they will do something. 299 00:23:12,916 --> 00:23:14,708 One or more of these, 300 00:23:14,708 --> 00:23:16,958 one or two of these will at least appear. 301 00:23:34,458 --> 00:23:39,250 When the Yom Kippur War came in & apos; 73, 302 00:23:39,250 --> 00:23:43,500 once again, the warning indicator starts to appear. 303 00:23:49,500 --> 00:23:53,541 And once again at os 79 with Afghanistan. 304 00:23:55,333 --> 00:23:57,958 It was about a week before the invasion. 305 00:23:57,958 --> 00:24:00,833 It's very close to the Christmas holidays. 306 00:24:00,833 --> 00:24:04,416 So at that time, I said, "well, they will approach 307 00:24:00,833 --> 00:24:04,416 until midnight on Christmas Eve 308 00:24:04,416 --> 00:24:08,666 because that's when everyone will fall asleep 309 00:24:04,416 --> 00:24:08,666 in the free world." 310 00:24:08,666 --> 00:24:11,333 And that's what they do. 311 00:24:11,333 --> 00:24:13,750 I go one hour. 312 00:24:28,333 --> 00:24:32,208 I don't understand why many people can't see 313 00:24:28,333 --> 00:24:32,208 what can I see. 314 00:24:34,916 --> 00:24:36,750 I do not see that understanding 315 00:24:36,750 --> 00:24:41,541 as something more than just a greater understanding 316 00:24:41,541 --> 00:24:44,458 people and how they operate. 317 00:24:53,500 --> 00:24:55,625 [Drake] I sit at the terrorism table 318 00:24:55,625 --> 00:24:59,708 at the Pentagon in 1993 I was at the table when they tried to drop 319 00:24:59,708 --> 00:25:02,416 320 00:25:02,416 --> 00:25:05,333 The World Trade Center rose for the first time with a truck bomb. 321 00:25:06,833 --> 00:25:09,875 That's when I first learned about Osama bin Laden. 322 00:25:12,375 --> 00:25:17,333 I remember clearly publishing a report 323 00:25:17,333 --> 00:25:21,583 where we say this is a serious problem. 324 00:25:21,583 --> 00:25:26,541 This is not a one-time event. 325 00:25:26,541 --> 00:25:28,416 There is a bigger movement here, 326 00:25:28,416 --> 00:25:31,458 and they plan to do more. 327 00:25:31,458 --> 00:25:33,500 Al-Qaeda, base, 328 00:25:33,500 --> 00:25:35,416 and Osama bin Laden as their leaders 329 00:25:35,416 --> 00:25:37,458 not only issued a statement, 330 00:25:37,458 --> 00:25:40,958 they really call for action. 331 00:25:43,041 --> 00:25:45,708 Senior military officer, J2, 332 00:25:45,708 --> 00:25:47,375 report to the joint chief of staff, 333 00:25:47,375 --> 00:25:49,791 come to our warning center 334 00:25:49,791 --> 00:25:52,833 at the National Military Joint Intelligence Center, 335 00:25:52,833 --> 00:25:54,791 and he said, "Yes, I'm reading your report. 336 00:25:54,791 --> 00:25:58,125 Who cares about some rombong spouting fatwas 337 00:25:58,125 --> 00:26:01,041 in the desert under a fig tree? 338 00:26:01,041 --> 00:26:02,875 Who cares? 339 00:26:02,875 --> 00:26:04,333 Not a threat. " 340 00:26:15,291 --> 00:26:19,666 [Roark] National Security Agency 341 00:26:15,291 --> 00:26:19,666 has traditionally been 342 00:26:19,666 --> 00:26:25,416 one of the most productive US intelligence agencies. 343 00:26:25,416 --> 00:26:31,583 We have relied heavily on it since World War II 344 00:26:25,416 --> 00:26:31,583 at least. 345 00:26:34,916 --> 00:26:38,833 When I get a National Security Agency account, 346 00:26:38,833 --> 00:26:42,875 I have heard that they are in very good condition. 347 00:26:42,875 --> 00:26:46,541 I go for intensive briefing rounds, 348 00:26:46,541 --> 00:26:48,750 and after about three months, 349 00:26:48,750 --> 00:26:53,208 I am shocked by the poor condition of the institution. 350 00:26:54,666 --> 00:26:58,833 We are very unprepared for the digital age. 351 00:26:58,833 --> 00:27:03,916 But the National Security Agency's management continues to think 352 00:27:03,916 --> 00:27:06,000 that they are the best in the world 353 00:27:06,000 --> 00:27:07,750 and have the best technology 354 00:27:07,750 --> 00:27:11,375 because this is always their reputation 355 00:27:11,375 --> 00:27:12,958 and they are sure 356 00:27:12,958 --> 00:27:15,541 that there is no fundamental problem. 357 00:27:15,541 --> 00:27:18,500 I am sure that there is a fundamental problem, 358 00:27:18,500 --> 00:27:22,500 both technical and cultural, 359 00:27:22,500 --> 00:27:26,833 and I became very worried very quickly. 360 00:27:26,833 --> 00:27:30,833 [Loomis] Look, they sink 361 00:27:26,833 --> 00:27:30,833 in garbage. 362 00:27:30,833 --> 00:27:36,083 The processes that exist before ThinThread appear 363 00:27:36,083 --> 00:27:40,250 are illegal garbage collectors, 364 00:27:40,250 --> 00:27:42,541 and they throw away all things 365 00:27:42,541 --> 00:27:44,541 into a very large storage system 366 00:27:44,541 --> 00:27:47,833 and analysts stutter trying to find out, 367 00:27:47,833 --> 00:27:51,250 good, you know, "what's important to me?" 368 00:28:08,958 --> 00:28:13,458 [Binney] ThinThread is the way we try 369 00:28:08,958 --> 00:28:13,458 to overcome the digital era. 370 00:28:16,583 --> 00:28:20,833 That is a question to be able to manage the volume of data. 371 00:28:20,833 --> 00:28:23,541 The terrorists use all cellphones, 372 00:28:23,541 --> 00:28:28,000 all land line phones, all internet connections 373 00:28:23,541 --> 00:28:28,000 to communicate. 374 00:28:30,541 --> 00:28:33,541 So it's a new Cold War, if you want, 375 00:28:33,541 --> 00:28:37,000 is a digital world explosion around the world. 376 00:28:38,958 --> 00:28:41,583 NSA takes a different perspective that says, 377 00:28:41,583 --> 00:28:43,500 "let's collect everything 378 00:28:43,500 --> 00:28:46,166 and then we will ask our analyst to find out later." 379 00:28:50,500 --> 00:28:52,083 The problem is, after they collect everything, 380 00:28:52,083 --> 00:28:54,166 Your analyst can't find out. 381 00:28:54,166 --> 00:28:56,833 Too much. They can't pass it 382 00:28:54,166 --> 00:28:56,833 every day. 383 00:28:56,833 --> 00:29:01,208 They will make their database interesting and they have hundreds of 384 00:28:56,833 --> 00:29:01,208 thousands of returns. 385 00:29:01,208 --> 00:29:04,458 You can't pass it. 386 00:29:04,458 --> 00:29:07,333 You bury your analyst with meaningless data. 387 00:29:13,125 --> 00:29:17,458 That's when I started to see what we had to do 388 00:29:17,458 --> 00:29:20,500 to solve data volume problems 389 00:29:20,500 --> 00:29:25,083 and how we can isolate important things 390 00:29:20,500 --> 00:29:25,083 for our analysts to see. 391 00:29:25,083 --> 00:29:27,375 And the key is metadata. 392 00:29:30,000 --> 00:29:34,291 Only uses metadata in terms of relationships 393 00:29:30,000 --> 00:29:34,291 throughout the network. 394 00:29:38,750 --> 00:29:41,125 So you don't need to look internally at the content. 395 00:29:41,125 --> 00:29:43,166 You pay more attention to relationships 396 00:29:43,166 --> 00:29:44,958 of people who communicate 397 00:29:44,958 --> 00:29:47,708 or organizations that communicate in the world. 398 00:29:47,708 --> 00:29:51,708 So that's how you can look into a large amount of data 399 00:29:47,708 --> 00:29:51,708 fast enough, 400 00:29:51,708 --> 00:29:54,125 effective, and interesting data 401 00:29:51,708 --> 00:29:54,125 is relevant 402 00:29:54,125 --> 00:29:56,375 to the target you want to analyze. 403 00:30:11,250 --> 00:30:13,791 My biggest fear in all my work at NSA 404 00:30:13,791 --> 00:30:17,708 is fear of human inaccuracy and human failure 405 00:30:17,708 --> 00:30:19,708 in terms of interpreting things correctly 406 00:30:19,708 --> 00:30:22,750 or in terms of recognizing something. 407 00:30:24,333 --> 00:30:27,541 I feel that the process must be fully automatic 408 00:30:27,541 --> 00:30:30,291 as much as possible so that information is entered 409 00:30:30,291 --> 00:30:33,041 untouched by human hands. 410 00:30:37,791 --> 00:30:39,291 Oops. 411 00:30:47,625 --> 00:30:50,416 Many people call me things like "Great Satan," 412 00:30:50,416 --> 00:30:55,208 or, you know, "the evil one," I think, 413 00:30:55,208 --> 00:30:57,458 and many other names, you know. 414 00:31:12,625 --> 00:31:15,291 So I have a group of people who don't want to talk to me 415 00:31:15,291 --> 00:31:17,250 or get involved with me 416 00:31:17,250 --> 00:31:21,833 because they feel that if they do, they will lose their jobs. 417 00:31:30,208 --> 00:31:33,541 I was sitting at my desk in pencil and paper trying to build the Soviet military structure 418 00:31:33,541 --> 00:31:36,583 command and control system, of all strengths. 419 00:31:36,583 --> 00:31:41,000 To do this, I need a little help 420 00:31:43,208 --> 00:31:48,208 from experts in cryptologists. 421 00:31:43,208 --> 00:31:48,208 So I came to them to get the part they had 422 00:31:48,208 --> 00:31:52,666 in ownership. 423 00:31:48,208 --> 00:31:52,666 And they come back with a very small answer, 424 00:31:52,666 --> 00:31:56,416 and I say, "if you don't want to solve this problem, 425 00:31:56,416 --> 00:32:00,291 426 00:32:00,291 --> 00:32:04,375 just give a little and I will do it. " 427 00:32:04,375 --> 00:32:06,791 I can't wait for them. 428 00:32:13,333 --> 00:32:17,458 For nuclear intercontinental ballistic missiles to be fired, 429 00:32:17,458 --> 00:32:19,458 it takes no more than 30 minutes 430 00:32:19,458 --> 00:32:21,750 to go from one continent to another. 431 00:32:28,625 --> 00:32:31,416 That means you want to reply or not 432 00:32:31,416 --> 00:32:33,083 before a weapon starts landing, 433 00:32:33,083 --> 00:32:35,791 You have 30 minutes to make that decision. For a long time 434 00:32:55,375 --> 00:32:58,416 in my career at NSA, 435 00:32:58,416 --> 00:33:01,583 I tried to work-- this might be running 436 00:33:01,583 --> 00:33:04,000 sequence 13 years, 437 00:33:38,958 --> 00:33:41,375 I tried to work with computer people 438 00:33:41,375 --> 00:33:45,583 because I want them to do certain programs 439 00:33:41,375 --> 00:33:45,583 that will help me in what I try to do. 440 00:33:45,583 --> 00:33:48,541 441 00:33:48,541 --> 00:33:50,791 442 00:33:50,791 --> 00:33:54,000 443 00:33:56,500 --> 00:33:59,833 Every time I ask them to do something for me, 444 00:33:59,833 --> 00:34:02,916 they will say, "okay, please send us a memo 445 00:34:02,916 --> 00:34:05,416 say you have this requirement." 446 00:34:08,416 --> 00:34:11,750 So I will send a memo to them after the memo. 447 00:34:11,750 --> 00:34:14,416 That gives them requirements. 448 00:34:14,416 --> 00:34:16,833 That requirement gives them justification 449 00:34:16,833 --> 00:34:20,500 go to congress or other people internally at NSA 450 00:34:16,833 --> 00:34:20,500 and ask for money. 451 00:34:20,500 --> 00:34:23,416 So it helps them build their empire, you know? 452 00:34:23,416 --> 00:34:25,750 But in the meantime, they will never solve my problem. 453 00:34:25,750 --> 00:34:30,375 They will only take money and keep asking me 454 00:34:25,750 --> 00:34:30,375 other requirements. 455 00:34:37,250 --> 00:34:39,375 At one time in 1983, 456 00:34:39,375 --> 00:34:43,291 The magic of this PC appears on my desk. 457 00:34:47,000 --> 00:34:48,625 I have a friend who is possible 458 00:34:48,625 --> 00:34:51,208 the best C language programmer at NSA. 459 00:34:51,208 --> 00:34:53,583 His name is Bill, too, and I say, "Bill, 460 00:34:53,583 --> 00:34:55,500 What do you think we can do with this PC? 461 00:34:55,500 --> 00:34:57,250 If I can get a shared algorithm, 462 00:34:57,250 --> 00:34:59,291 do you think you can program it in this 463 00:34:59,291 --> 00:35:02,166 two disk drives, 64k ram pc? 464 00:35:02,166 --> 00:35:04,333 He said, "Yes, I think I can do that." 465 00:35:04,333 --> 00:35:06,500 I say, "extraordinary." So we will type questions from the problem unresolved 466 00:35:09,458 --> 00:35:14,083 from the database... 467 00:35:09,458 --> 00:35:14,083 and rising will appear the answer. my small pc drive 468 00:35:16,750 --> 00:35:20,041 and get the answer right away. 469 00:35:20,041 --> 00:35:23,208 So I have to tell the computer people, 470 00:35:23,208 --> 00:35:25,375 and I say, "You know, I have this little program 471 00:35:25,375 --> 00:35:28,166 below here. 472 00:35:28,166 --> 00:35:30,541 473 00:35:32,750 --> 00:35:36,291 474 00:35:36,291 --> 00:35:38,625 475 00:35:36,291 --> 00:35:38,625 476 00:35:38,625 --> 00:35:40,291 You might want to see this. " 477 00:35:40,291 --> 00:35:42,791 And I have this template from the database, 478 00:35:42,791 --> 00:35:44,625 and I will go through," see, it doesn't finish this here. 479 00:35:42,791 --> 00:35:44,625 Watch this here. " 480 00:35:44,625 --> 00:35:46,125 And I will put it in my little PC, 481 00:35:46,125 --> 00:35:48,625 and the answer will come. 482 00:35:48,625 --> 00:35:51,500 There is one more, and I will type it there, 483 00:35:48,625 --> 00:35:51,500 and up will appear the answer. 484 00:35:51,500 --> 00:35:54,166 They start sweating , I can see. 485 00:35:54,166 --> 00:35:56,416 And I say, "don't you think it's neat?" 486 00:35:56,416 --> 00:35:58,458 He said, "Yes, don't you think it should be 487 00:35:56,416 --> 00:35:58,458 are on the mainframe? " 488 00:35:58,458 --> 00:36:00,541 I say," sure. I think it's supposed to be 489 00:35:58,458 --> 00:36:00,541 on mainframe. 490 00:36:00,541 --> 00:36:02,958 Why don't you send me a memo and I will give it to you? " 491 00:36:02,958 --> 00:36:05,083 I think it's great. 492 00:36:07,458 --> 00:36:10,750 In this process, of course, I study, very simply, 493 00:36:10,750 --> 00:36:13,458 if you want something done, you just have to do it. 494 00:36:13,458 --> 00:36:17,916 You never ask permission, just ask forgiveness, 495 00:36:13,458 --> 00:36:17,916 if you have to. 496 00:36:17,916 --> 00:36:20,166 In the end, sometimes you don't need to do it. 497 00:36:20,166 --> 00:36:23,500 After you solve the problem, it's no longer a problem. 498 00:36:32,416 --> 00:36:34,666 My philosophy is very simple. 499 00:36:34,666 --> 00:36:36,708 If someone says something is impossible, 500 00:36:36,708 --> 00:36:39,375 that's something you have to do. 501 00:36:39,375 --> 00:36:41,958 It's like open thinking. You do not limit your thinking. 502 00:36:41,958 --> 00:36:45,416 You let it float wherever it wants. 503 00:36:45,416 --> 00:36:49,916 So it gives you ideas about how you can be creative 504 00:36:45,416 --> 00:36:49,916 in any environment. 505 00:36:49,916 --> 00:36:51,750 And that's what I'm looking for, 506 00:36:51,750 --> 00:36:54,291 Be creative wherever I go. 507 00:36:54,291 --> 00:36:57,750 And that's what is called SARC, Sigint Automation Research Center, 508 00:36:54,291 --> 00:36:57,750 all about. 509 00:36:57,750 --> 00:36:59,625 510 00:37:28,750 --> 00:37:31,750 [Drake] The SARC is this 511 00:37:28,750 --> 00:37:31,750 Organization skunk work, 512 00:37:31,750 --> 00:37:34,166 about a dozen people. 513 00:37:34,166 --> 00:37:37,333 Bill Binney is one of the founders. 514 00:37:37,333 --> 00:37:39,750 Ed Loomis is an integrator. 515 00:37:39,750 --> 00:37:43,833 Kirk Weibe at that time was like a business manager and analyst. 516 00:37:39,750 --> 00:37:43,833 And they also have other people's supporters. 517 00:37:43,833 --> 00:37:47,291 And they have several contractors. 518 00:37:43,833 --> 00:37:47,291 SARC prides itself on having a very small team 519 00:37:47,291 --> 00:37:51,958 it's very creative and flexible. 520 00:37:51,958 --> 00:37:57,125 They don't want a lot of bureaucracy. 521 00:37:57,125 --> 00:37:59,416 They have a very low profile when I ask 522 00:37:59,416 --> 00:38:03,041 briefing from them, 523 00:37:59,416 --> 00:38:03,041 management doesn't even know about them. 524 00:38:03,041 --> 00:38:05,791 They must fight to find out who they are. 525 00:38:05,791 --> 00:38:09,416 They hide a bit until their system is perfect. 526 00:38:09,416 --> 00:38:15,000 [Drake] That's amazing 527 00:38:16,875 --> 00:38:20,666 organization. 528 00:38:16,875 --> 00:38:20,666 529 00:38:20,666 --> 00:38:23,833 And Bill, he is the algorithmic brain. 530 00:38:23,833 --> 00:38:27,875 He is a crypto-mathematician behind the algorithm 531 00:38:27,875 --> 00:38:30,250 from what is known as ThinThread. 532 00:38:38,833 --> 00:38:41,500 People say to me, "You must be afraid of Bill." 533 00:38:44,583 --> 00:38:46,416 And the reason you have to be afraid of Bill 534 00:38:46,416 --> 00:38:49,333 is he like this super crypto-mathematician. 535 00:38:49,333 --> 00:38:52,708 And if something goes wrong, he will destroy you. 536 00:38:54,791 --> 00:38:58,541 So I finally called him, we made an agreement to meet, 537 00:38:58,541 --> 00:39:00,875 and I finally appeared in his office one morning. 538 00:39:00,875 --> 00:39:03,541 I spent several hours with him, 539 00:39:00,875 --> 00:39:03,541 and that's immediately clear 540 00:39:03,541 --> 00:39:06,916 in the first 15 minutes we will do it 541 00:39:03,541 --> 00:39:06,916 really, very good. 542 00:39:06,916 --> 00:39:11,583 Because of the whole first part of our conversation 543 00:39:11,583 --> 00:39:13,125 are all mathematically based. 544 00:39:13,125 --> 00:39:16,583 The thing Bill likes best is mathematics. 545 00:39:16,583 --> 00:39:19,791 As soon as someone proposes something mathematical, 546 00:39:19,791 --> 00:39:22,416 His eyes are really lit and he's happy 547 00:39:22,416 --> 00:39:24,750 and he will start talking about it, you know? 548 00:39:24,750 --> 00:39:26,500 He only loves mathematics. 549 00:39:26,500 --> 00:39:30,125 And amazingly he found his profession, 550 00:39:30,125 --> 00:39:32,250 You know, what he really has to do. 551 00:39:34,875 --> 00:39:37,833 [Binney] The beauty of mathematics 552 00:39:34,875 --> 00:39:37,833 is an effort 553 00:39:37,833 --> 00:39:41,833 for common sense structure 554 00:39:41,833 --> 00:39:44,833 and consistency in the universe. 555 00:39:48,333 --> 00:39:50,750 That's all. 556 00:39:54,083 --> 00:39:56,041 There is no chaos. 557 00:39:56,041 --> 00:39:59,958 Nothing is unlimited. 558 00:39:59,958 --> 00:40:03,125 Everything is structured. 559 00:40:05,541 --> 00:40:08,541 And it's only a matter of finding that structure. 560 00:40:29,541 --> 00:40:32,208 I basically imagine the 561 00:40:32,208 --> 00:40:36,500 562 00:40:43,416 --> 00:40:47,666 graph as a very large globe, look? 563 00:40:50,125 --> 00:40:52,750 With a total of about 7 billion nodes in it, or dots. 564 00:40:54,500 --> 00:40:57,791 And has all the connections of all these individuals 565 00:40:57,791 --> 00:41:01,250 with all the other connections they have anywhere in the world. 566 00:41:12,750 --> 00:41:16,250 Think of yourself as drifting into the world. 567 00:41:20,333 --> 00:41:22,041 So you will enter the world 568 00:41:22,041 --> 00:41:25,250 and you can go anywhere anywhere in the world 569 00:41:25,250 --> 00:41:28,208 and look at a certain point to see the relationship 570 00:41:28,208 --> 00:41:31,333 they have all the points in the world. 571 00:41:36,541 --> 00:41:39,791 When you go to the world, you choose a point, 572 00:41:39,791 --> 00:41:43,291 and you can pull it out of the relationship graph, 573 00:41:43,291 --> 00:41:45,166 and with that will come all nodes 574 00:41:45,166 --> 00:41:49,125 that he has a relationship with. 575 00:41:49,125 --> 00:41:51,916 When you pull the node out and the community, if you want, 576 00:41:51,916 --> 00:41:53,375 the social network it has, 577 00:41:53,375 --> 00:41:55,166 You pull all backup data 578 00:41:55,166 --> 00:41:58,416 which creates the relationship to start 579 00:41:58,416 --> 00:42:01,291 so you can now set the relationship time 580 00:42:01,291 --> 00:42:04,000 and see interactions over a certain period of time 581 00:42:04,000 --> 00:42:07,041 whatever you want to find. 582 00:42:07,041 --> 00:42:10,291 So that's how I imagine graphics. 583 00:42:24,958 --> 00:42:29,333 [Loomis] My interest is 584 00:42:24,958 --> 00:42:29,333 in making Bill Binney happy. 585 00:42:29,333 --> 00:42:32,375 Bill Binney is a traffic analyst. 586 00:42:32,375 --> 00:42:38,166 So my focus is actually creating metadata for him 587 00:42:38,166 --> 00:42:42,500 that he can do analytic traffic. 588 00:42:45,083 --> 00:42:49,458 You can extract a lot about someone's life 589 00:42:49,458 --> 00:42:52,250 just by looking at metadata. 590 00:42:52,250 --> 00:42:57,333 And today, when you take all metadata 591 00:42:57,333 --> 00:43:01,041 that appears throughout the world 592 00:43:01,041 --> 00:43:03,958 by GPS, by your mobile, 593 00:43:03,958 --> 00:43:07,208 by your transponder 594 00:43:07,208 --> 00:43:10,541 for your E-Zpass on the highway, 595 00:43:10,541 --> 00:43:15,375 with your credit card when you enter it in the ATM machine 596 00:43:15,375 --> 00:43:19,125 or when you put it in the cash register, 597 00:43:19,125 --> 00:43:21,500 check-out line, 598 00:43:21,500 --> 00:43:24,416 all the data is put together all 599 00:43:24,416 --> 00:43:29,708 and everything goes back to you, individual. 600 00:43:31,416 --> 00:43:34,625 It doesn't matter what you say in an email or what website you visit or what you download. 601 00:43:34,625 --> 00:43:40,291 What matters is your digital behavior pattern 602 00:43:40,291 --> 00:43:45,833 and what fingerprints he left 603 00:43:45,833 --> 00:43:48,333 of what you have done. 604 00:43:48,333 --> 00:43:50,416 I started building my part of what I was considering 605 00:44:06,791 --> 00:44:11,041 ThinThread program, 606 00:44:06,791 --> 00:44:11,041 which is the backend for data analysis 607 00:44:11,041 --> 00:44:14,916 after being acquired. 608 00:44:11,041 --> 00:44:14,916 Ed is doing a front end, doing sessionizer 609 00:44:14,916 --> 00:44:17,125 collect data together 610 00:44:17,125 --> 00:44:18,666 and assemble it for me to see. 611 00:44:18,666 --> 00:44:21,708 Ed sessionizer is our starting point 612 00:44:27,083 --> 00:44:29,083 to access and scan the internet for important information. 613 00:44:29,083 --> 00:44:33,791 I am sure that the internet is a new way 614 00:44:38,500 --> 00:44:43,083 communication 615 00:44:38,500 --> 00:44:43,083 for terrorists and criminals. 616 00:44:43,083 --> 00:44:45,166 617 00:44:45,166 --> 00:44:47,125 And we knew at that time that some of them 618 00:44:47,125 --> 00:44:49,333 has moved in that direction. 619 00:44:54,333 --> 00:44:57,041 [Drake] Internet explodes. 620 00:44:57,041 --> 00:44:59,291 NSA is actually catching up. 621 00:44:59,291 --> 00:45:02,791 They are so far behind time. 622 00:45:02,791 --> 00:45:07,250 NSA management seriously considers, not kidding, 623 00:45:07,250 --> 00:45:12,000 do they really give people 624 00:45:07,250 --> 00:45:12,000 e-mail technology. 625 00:45:12,000 --> 00:45:16,000 And the reason is we don't know what they are doing 626 00:45:12,000 --> 00:45:16,000 to send each other. 627 00:45:18,708 --> 00:45:22,208 And there are no secrets that are worth knowing on the internet. 628 00:45:22,208 --> 00:45:24,875 Everything is open. It's no secret. 629 00:45:24,875 --> 00:45:28,083 There is no effort. We want real secrets. 630 00:45:28,083 --> 00:45:29,500 We don't-- internet? 631 00:45:29,500 --> 00:45:31,166 You can't have a secret internet. 632 00:45:39,083 --> 00:45:41,875 Around 1996, I believe that, 633 00:45:41,875 --> 00:45:45,458 we found Inmarsat Osama bin Laden's phone number, 634 00:45:45,458 --> 00:45:48,416 and we use it to follow its movements 635 00:45:48,416 --> 00:45:52,583 and intentions from & apos; 96 to & apos; 98. 636 00:45:52,583 --> 00:45:55,083 Until someone compromises the facts 637 00:45:55,083 --> 00:45:58,000 that we have a specific telephone number, 638 00:45:55,083 --> 00:45:58,000 and he gave the number. 639 00:45:58,000 --> 00:46:02,791 And after that, we lost it as a source 640 00:45:58,000 --> 00:46:02,791 intelligence. 641 00:46:20,625 --> 00:46:24,000 [Koppel] More than 80 people died, 642 00:46:20,625 --> 00:46:24,000 more than 1,700 people are injured 643 00:46:24,000 --> 00:46:28,000 in two bomb blasts today, which exploded for only a few minutes 644 00:46:28,000 --> 00:46:30,625 and 450 miles apart. 645 00:46:30,625 --> 00:46:33,875 The explosion will explode at the US embassy 646 00:46:33,875 --> 00:46:36,625 in Dar es Salaam, Tanzania, and Nairobi, Kenya, 647 00:46:36,625 --> 00:46:39,041 clearly a part of someone's war 648 00:46:39,041 --> 00:46:42,250 against the United States, although it's still unclear 649 00:46:42,250 --> 00:46:44,791 at this hour who is our enemy. 650 00:46:44,791 --> 00:46:47,125 [man] There is smoke 651 00:46:44,791 --> 00:46:47,125 and debris everywhere. 652 00:46:47,125 --> 00:46:50,333 We immediately leave the office because we don't know 653 00:46:47,125 --> 00:46:50,333 What has happened. 654 00:46:50,333 --> 00:46:52,250 And there are people who are naked there, 655 00:46:52,250 --> 00:46:57,291 and everyone we visit is covered in blood. 656 00:46:57,291 --> 00:46:59,583 [newscaster] We join now 657 00:46:57,291 --> 00:46:59,583 from the White House 658 00:46:59,583 --> 00:47:02,708 by US national security adviser, Sandy Burger. 659 00:47:02,708 --> 00:47:06,000 Is this a US intelligence failure? 660 00:47:06,000 --> 00:47:08,416 [Burger] Well, the investigation 661 00:47:06,000 --> 00:47:08,416 is happening. 662 00:47:08,416 --> 00:47:10,666 I don't believe that is the problem, and I think that will happen 663 00:47:10,666 --> 00:47:13,666 it's not appropriate for me to comment on 664 00:47:13,666 --> 00:47:17,000 what we know, what we don't know. 665 00:47:25,416 --> 00:47:27,958 [Binney] In August 1998, 666 00:47:27,958 --> 00:47:33,166 we managed to set up our sessionizer 667 00:47:27,958 --> 00:47:33,166 at the optical fiber level. 668 00:47:35,125 --> 00:47:37,541 Ed gives a copy of the sessionizer 669 00:47:37,541 --> 00:47:39,791 to our friends in Bad Aibling, 670 00:47:39,791 --> 00:47:44,500 one of our echelon sites to collect data 671 00:47:39,791 --> 00:47:44,500 in southern Germany. 672 00:47:44,500 --> 00:47:47,166 We just want to say, "here, why don't you try this 673 00:47:47,166 --> 00:47:50,000 and see what you think and give us feedback." 674 00:47:50,000 --> 00:47:54,875 And he said, "Wow, this sessionizer really looks 675 00:47:50,000 --> 00:47:54,875 great and works great." 676 00:47:54,875 --> 00:47:58,375 He said, you know, "I thought I would put it on the whole site." 677 00:48:04,458 --> 00:48:09,166 They put it on their system Friday night. 678 00:48:09,166 --> 00:48:11,250 And when they do that, 679 00:48:11,250 --> 00:48:14,500 starts to produce so much information 680 00:48:14,500 --> 00:48:18,083 and return it to NSA 681 00:48:18,083 --> 00:48:20,458 that on Saturday morning it almost fell 682 00:48:20,458 --> 00:48:23,958 all storage systems inside the NSA. 683 00:48:26,708 --> 00:48:31,625 Too much data entered. They can't handle it. 684 00:48:31,625 --> 00:48:36,875 [Loomis] We were told that it brought 685 00:48:31,625 --> 00:48:36,875 storage system to his knee. 686 00:48:38,125 --> 00:48:41,125 And we turn it off. 687 00:48:41,125 --> 00:48:44,083 So one programmer must come during the weekend 688 00:48:44,083 --> 00:48:46,500 and turn off sessionizer. 689 00:48:55,916 --> 00:48:58,500 [Binney] This particular test 690 00:48:55,916 --> 00:48:58,500 clearly shows 691 00:48:58,500 --> 00:49:00,500 that there is more data there 692 00:49:00,500 --> 00:49:04,041 is far more valuable as a source of information 693 00:49:04,041 --> 00:49:08,083 from anyone who is aware at the NSA. 694 00:49:08,083 --> 00:49:09,875 This is a kind of wake up call 695 00:49:09,875 --> 00:49:11,583 which I think makes it clear to them 696 00:49:11,583 --> 00:49:13,458 that they need to open their minds 697 00:49:13,458 --> 00:49:16,041 to a much larger scale than they think. 698 00:49:16,041 --> 00:49:19,208 [beeping] 699 00:49:35,000 --> 00:49:39,458 [Wiebe] I've heard about Bill Binney, 700 00:49:35,000 --> 00:49:39,458 but haven't really met him. 701 00:49:42,000 --> 00:49:45,291 I call him. I said, "Bill, 702 00:49:45,291 --> 00:49:47,041 Can I go down and see you 703 00:49:47,041 --> 00:49:50,291 and what your organization is doing?" 704 00:49:52,083 --> 00:49:55,666 He said, "sure. Come down." 705 00:49:55,666 --> 00:49:58,666 So I went down, I joined Bill Binney 706 00:49:58,666 --> 00:50:02,666 at the Sigint Automation Research Center. 707 00:50:02,666 --> 00:50:06,875 And I looked around, and when I met these people 708 00:50:02,666 --> 00:50:06,875 and talk to them 709 00:50:06,875 --> 00:50:09,708 and interview them, find out who did what, 710 00:50:09,708 --> 00:50:14,541 and start seeing results from their efforts, 711 00:50:14,541 --> 00:50:17,750 I became really excited. 712 00:50:19,875 --> 00:50:24,041 In the face of the challenges of big data, 713 00:50:24,041 --> 00:50:28,041 digital communication, and internet, 714 00:50:28,041 --> 00:50:31,333 I see the answer right in front of me. 715 00:50:33,041 --> 00:50:36,083 This small research organization 716 00:50:36,083 --> 00:50:40,125 has the key to the future of the NSA. 717 00:50:40,125 --> 00:50:44,041 My immediate attention is 718 00:50:44,041 --> 00:50:47,416 Do anyone else know that? 719 00:50:47,416 --> 00:50:49,833 Do they even recognize-- 720 00:50:49,833 --> 00:50:53,458 is there anyone in any position of influence or power 721 00:50:53,458 --> 00:50:57,875 even recognize what they have? 722 00:51:16,083 --> 00:51:18,250 [Roark] I am aware of technology 723 00:51:18,250 --> 00:51:21,916 that goes to ThinThread from 1997. 724 00:51:26,291 --> 00:51:30,458 I got a formal explanation from Bill and Ed and their team, 725 00:51:30,458 --> 00:51:32,916 and I think it's very impressive compared to what I heard at the NSA. 726 00:51:32,916 --> 00:51:36,208 I think it looks very promising. 727 00:51:37,666 --> 00:51:41,125 I started giving them money. 728 00:51:41,125 --> 00:51:43,416 And I will make Congress agree 729 00:51:43,416 --> 00:51:45,833 to ensure that they are funded to be developed 730 00:51:45,833 --> 00:51:50,666 their system... 731 00:51:45,833 --> 00:51:50,666 Because the agency admits they must update 732 00:51:55,375 --> 00:51:59,625 to the digital era from the analog era. 733 00:51:59,625 --> 00:52:03,375 They haven't started yet. 734 00:52:03,375 --> 00:52:06,208 And even under analog systems, 735 00:52:06,208 --> 00:52:08,250 there is a flood of incoming data. 736 00:52:08,250 --> 00:52:12,333 And after you get digital data, 737 00:52:12,333 --> 00:52:14,041 You get this high capacity pipeline, 738 00:52:14,041 --> 00:52:16,125 it will be much worse. 739 00:52:16,125 --> 00:52:18,375 So it will be important that there are several ways 740 00:52:18,375 --> 00:52:22,458 to choose a target from this. 741 00:52:22,458 --> 00:52:24,375 742 00:52:24,375 --> 00:52:27,083 Some ways are far better than the keyword system 743 00:52:27,083 --> 00:52:30,208 the NSA used at that time. 744 00:52:43,333 --> 00:52:45,416 [Binney] Shortly after that 745 00:52:43,333 --> 00:52:45,416 Bad Aibling test, 746 00:52:45,416 --> 00:52:47,500 we have the entire system running, 747 00:52:47,500 --> 00:52:51,541 then from there, we take more data 748 00:52:51,541 --> 00:52:55,000 a large number of cellphones and a large number of computers. 749 00:53:01,458 --> 00:53:07,083 We started to consolidate it into my big chart, 750 00:53:07,083 --> 00:53:09,500 which we call the big ass graph. 751 00:53:14,375 --> 00:53:16,500 We begin to attract large amounts of data 752 00:53:16,500 --> 00:53:18,166 and the system works fine, 753 00:53:18,166 --> 00:53:20,958 we can see there is no limit to that... 754 00:53:25,333 --> 00:53:28,958 Building relationships between billions of people. 755 00:53:34,000 --> 00:53:37,958 I mean, we're talking trillions of transactions. 756 00:53:39,291 --> 00:53:41,583 It is quite clear that we are building 757 00:53:41,583 --> 00:53:46,250 the most powerful analytical tool that has been developed 758 00:53:41,583 --> 00:53:46,250 in history 759 00:53:46,250 --> 00:53:50,916 to monitor, basically, the whole world 760 00:53:50,916 --> 00:53:53,083 in the near future. 761 00:54:08,916 --> 00:54:13,500 This automatically monitors each member of the population. 762 00:54:16,083 --> 00:54:19,583 You attack everyone's privacy. 763 00:54:22,625 --> 00:54:24,458 That doesn't match democracy. 764 00:54:24,458 --> 00:54:27,250 That is not appropriate. 765 00:54:29,750 --> 00:54:32,041 It's like a station on super steroids 766 00:54:32,041 --> 00:54:34,958 or KGB on super steroids, huh? 767 00:54:34,958 --> 00:54:38,333 These are things they can't even dream of. 768 00:54:43,625 --> 00:54:46,333 That's where I, specifically, say we have to do something 769 00:54:46,333 --> 00:54:48,291 to protect individuals here, 770 00:54:48,291 --> 00:54:50,291 especially those who are innocent 771 00:54:50,291 --> 00:54:52,958 doing nothing wrong. 772 00:54:52,958 --> 00:54:57,500 There is no reason to have this data about them. 773 00:55:14,791 --> 00:55:19,375 [Roark] General Hayden appears 774 00:55:14,791 --> 00:55:19,375 as the new director of the NSA. 775 00:55:19,375 --> 00:55:22,375 At that time, congressional intelligence staff 776 00:55:22,375 --> 00:55:24,958 have become very disappointed 777 00:55:24,958 --> 00:55:28,500 with NSA's ability to manage modernization. 778 00:55:30,291 --> 00:55:33,041 He rather comes in the sense of 779 00:55:33,041 --> 00:55:35,208 that he is willing to make changes, 780 00:55:35,208 --> 00:55:38,333 although not necessarily in the area 781 00:55:38,333 --> 00:55:41,250 that congress is focused on, 782 00:55:41,250 --> 00:55:44,375 and he is a very fast speaker. 783 00:55:44,375 --> 00:55:47,166 When he will direct the members, he will speak very quickly. 784 00:55:47,166 --> 00:55:52,000 He will use all types of parables and analogies 785 00:55:52,000 --> 00:55:55,500 and everything that makes you scratch your head 786 00:55:52,000 --> 00:55:55,500 while he was hijacked forward, 787 00:55:55,500 --> 00:55:58,750 and he will survive with so much. 788 00:55:58,750 --> 00:56:00,958 I think the members, 789 00:56:00,958 --> 00:56:04,041 this is a topic that is quite difficult to understand 790 00:56:00,958 --> 00:56:04,041 start with, 791 00:56:04,041 --> 00:56:06,458 he leaves the members in dust. 792 00:56:09,333 --> 00:56:13,041 [Binney] When Michael Hayden entered 793 00:56:09,333 --> 00:56:13,041 as NSA director, 794 00:56:13,041 --> 00:56:14,750 one of the first things he says is 795 00:56:14,750 --> 00:56:18,500 NSA becomes deaf and blind. 796 00:56:18,500 --> 00:56:22,625 So he created the NSA transformation office, NTO. 797 00:56:24,375 --> 00:56:27,083 A friend of mine becomes the head of NTO, 798 00:56:27,083 --> 00:56:29,125 and he realized what we did with ThinThread, 799 00:56:29,125 --> 00:56:31,625 and he thinks it's great. 800 00:56:31,625 --> 00:56:34,916 So he sent his deputy down, and he said, 801 00:56:34,916 --> 00:56:39,000 "What can you do with $ 1.2 billion?" 802 00:56:39,000 --> 00:56:44,125 Now, offered suddenly 1.2 billion 803 00:56:39,000 --> 00:56:44,125 is flabbergasting, huh? 804 00:56:44,125 --> 00:56:46,125 It's a bit difficult to handle. 805 00:56:46,125 --> 00:56:50,333 We have operated for only a few million dollars. 806 00:56:50,333 --> 00:56:52,583 So we asked them to give us a little time 807 00:56:52,583 --> 00:56:56,125 to try to find out what we can do 808 00:56:52,583 --> 00:56:56,125 do with it. 809 00:56:56,125 --> 00:56:57,791 So when he comes back in, 810 00:56:57,791 --> 00:57:02,541 we say we can improve the whole world-- 811 00:57:02,541 --> 00:57:04,291 everything we have in the world, 812 00:57:04,291 --> 00:57:06,875 and everything back here in the United States, 813 00:57:06,875 --> 00:57:08,833 but in the process, we can only spend 814 00:57:08,833 --> 00:57:13,083 maybe a little over $ 300 million to do it. 815 00:57:13,083 --> 00:57:15,500 So he said, "it's really great." 816 00:57:17,791 --> 00:57:19,625 A few days later, he went back down. 817 00:57:19,625 --> 00:57:21,541 He said, "You are doing a great job 818 00:57:21,541 --> 00:57:23,125 with 1.2 billion offers. 819 00:57:23,125 --> 00:57:27,708 Now what can you do with 1.4 billion?" Shortly after that my friend at NTO 820 00:57:27,708 --> 00:57:33,375 has been replaced. 821 00:57:27,708 --> 00:57:33,375 He is basically fired. 822 00:57:33,375 --> 00:57:35,208 And Hayden proposed a program called Trailblazer. 823 00:57:35,208 --> 00:57:41,083 And that is a multi-billion dollar program which will basically be outsourced 824 00:57:41,083 --> 00:57:43,791 and run by contractors and developed by contractors. 825 00:57:43,791 --> 00:57:45,666 [Roark] When the NSA starts 826 00:57:45,666 --> 00:57:49,416 Pioneer, 827 00:58:03,458 --> 00:58:06,708 I asked if they would send a design paper 828 00:58:03,458 --> 00:58:06,708 and let me read it. 829 00:58:06,708 --> 00:58:11,291 After I read it, I called NSA 830 00:58:11,291 --> 00:58:14,041 and I asked if I could talk to the Trailblazer management. 831 00:58:14,041 --> 00:58:16,750 832 00:58:16,750 --> 00:58:22,083 833 00:58:22,083 --> 00:58:28,041 And I said, "I want to make sure I understand this paper." 834 00:58:28,041 --> 00:58:30,583 I say, "from what I understand, 835 00:58:30,583 --> 00:58:33,208 modernizing digitally, what you want to do 836 00:58:33,208 --> 00:58:36,083 starts with your analog system 837 00:58:36,083 --> 00:58:40,375 and develops it into a digital system 838 00:58:40,375 --> 00:58:43,750 by issuing one part in time 839 00:58:43,750 --> 00:58:46,333 and increase and add more parts. " 840 00:58:46,333 --> 00:58:49,041 And they say, "yes, that is exactly." 841 00:58:49,041 --> 00:58:52,625 And I said, "it won't work. 842 00:58:52,625 --> 00:58:55,750 This is not a starter. It will never work." 843 00:58:59,333 --> 00:59:03,083 Why do we start from outdated analog technology 844 00:59:03,083 --> 00:59:07,166 and try to develop it into digital technology? 845 00:59:03,083 --> 00:59:07,166 That's just-- that doesn't make sense. 846 00:59:07,166 --> 00:59:11,583 You have to use new modern digital technology 847 00:59:07,166 --> 00:59:11,583 from the beginning. 848 00:59:14,625 --> 00:59:17,916 One reason I support ThinThread 849 00:59:17,916 --> 00:59:21,375 is I think it's far more innovative 850 00:59:21,375 --> 00:59:25,666 and far more simple and elegant in design 851 00:59:25,666 --> 00:59:27,708 of what they think, 852 00:59:27,708 --> 00:59:32,208 therefore may cause fewer problems. 853 00:59:51,500 --> 00:59:53,625 [Binney] From our testing 854 00:59:51,500 --> 00:59:53,625 with our big ass graph, 855 00:59:53,625 --> 00:59:56,291 very clear to us that we must protect 856 00:59:56,291 --> 00:59:58,916 individual privacy rights. 857 01:00:00,791 --> 01:00:04,500 So we designed ways to build protection 858 01:00:04,500 --> 01:00:07,541 and allows to encrypt all of its attributes 859 01:00:07,541 --> 01:00:09,291 so you don't know who they are 860 01:00:09,291 --> 01:00:11,250 and you can't analyze what they do 861 01:00:11,250 --> 01:00:14,750 because you can't identify them. 862 01:00:14,750 --> 01:00:17,500 And in cases where they are not even in the zone of suspicion, 863 01:00:17,500 --> 01:00:20,041 which we will define in the graph, 864 01:00:20,041 --> 01:00:22,416 their data won't even be taken, 865 01:00:22,416 --> 01:00:26,541 so no one has the opportunity to abuse 866 01:00:22,416 --> 01:00:26,541 their privacy. 867 01:00:28,166 --> 01:00:31,666 This is also the incoming metadata. 868 01:00:35,083 --> 01:00:37,583 The FISA filtering tool we have 869 01:00:37,583 --> 01:00:42,083 filter all American citizens 870 01:00:42,083 --> 01:00:46,291 or parties in America 871 01:00:46,291 --> 01:00:51,583 unless it's a specific target. 872 01:00:52,958 --> 01:00:55,166 But even then, you have to get a warrant 873 01:00:55,166 --> 01:00:57,500 to reveal identity. 874 01:01:03,458 --> 01:01:05,750 [Binney] In 2000, we had everything connected 875 01:01:05,750 --> 01:01:09,833 and everything together and walk from one end 876 01:01:05,750 --> 01:01:09,833 to others 877 01:01:11,791 --> 01:01:13,375 in 24 hours a day 878 01:01:13,375 --> 01:01:18,583 in three different locations that focus on Asia. 879 01:01:18,583 --> 01:01:21,791 The only site agreed upon 880 01:01:21,791 --> 01:01:25,083 to work with us 881 01:01:25,083 --> 01:01:29,416 are sites known as research sites. 882 01:01:41,333 --> 01:01:45,083 You know, I never called it a test site, but... 883 01:01:47,750 --> 01:01:50,791 I mean, they are sites that already exist, I mean. 884 01:01:50,791 --> 01:01:53,291 And they produce intelligence from it 885 01:01:53,291 --> 01:01:55,958 for a long time. 886 01:02:13,208 --> 01:02:18,500 [Roark] We went to NSA 887 01:02:13,208 --> 01:02:18,500 and ask for a brief explanation. 888 01:02:20,041 --> 01:02:24,375 The SARC team came and I was very surprised, 889 01:02:24,375 --> 01:02:29,250 all Trailblazer teams come to the briefing without being invited. 890 01:02:30,791 --> 01:02:32,750 Bill and Ed start the briefing, 891 01:02:32,750 --> 01:02:36,541 and the surprising thing is that everything goes on 892 01:02:36,541 --> 01:02:41,125 from the point of collection to reporting, 893 01:02:41,125 --> 01:02:44,083 and includes automatic reporting. 894 01:02:44,083 --> 01:02:46,875 So I turned to Trailblazer people, 895 01:02:46,875 --> 01:02:48,875 "Will you enter this into the Trailblazer? 896 01:02:48,875 --> 01:02:50,833 Doesn't this help you?" 897 01:02:50,833 --> 01:02:54,958 And they are pretty much rambling and stiff-faced. 898 01:02:54,958 --> 01:02:59,041 And apparently SARC got a lot of problems 899 01:02:54,958 --> 01:02:59,041 for this 900 01:02:59,041 --> 01:03:03,541 after me and other congressional staff left. 901 01:03:07,583 --> 01:03:11,416 General Hayden calls the entire SARC team, 902 01:03:11,416 --> 01:03:14,458 fence them in his office, dress them up, 903 01:03:14,458 --> 01:03:20,041 scold them without letting them have the opportunity to speak. 904 01:03:20,041 --> 01:03:24,208 And then issue dir-gram 905 01:03:24,208 --> 01:03:26,416 notify the entire NSA 906 01:03:26,416 --> 01:03:29,583 that after a company decision is made, 907 01:03:29,583 --> 01:03:32,541 that they don't damage it with Congress. 908 01:03:34,666 --> 01:03:39,833 In other words, they have to cover it 909 01:03:34,666 --> 01:03:39,833 adverse information. 910 01:03:41,750 --> 01:03:45,375 That, for me, the absolute clarion call 911 01:03:45,375 --> 01:03:47,125 to make Congress in darkness. 912 01:03:47,125 --> 01:03:49,375 I think it's very insolent. 913 01:03:58,375 --> 01:04:01,125 [Binney] General Hayden basically said 914 01:04:01,125 --> 01:04:04,000 ThinThread there is no contribution to the Trailblazer program. 915 01:04:04,000 --> 01:04:08,166 Trailblazer is the program, and we won't have it 916 01:04:04,000 --> 01:04:08,166 other programs. 917 01:04:11,916 --> 01:04:14,458 ThinThread, in my view, after we have everything together, 918 01:04:14,458 --> 01:04:18,416 solve all problems of volume, speed, and variation. 919 01:04:20,083 --> 01:04:23,125 We have solved all the problems 920 01:04:23,125 --> 01:04:26,583 that they claim is a problem. 921 01:04:28,291 --> 01:04:34,208 But they reject it as a risk mitigation process. 922 01:04:34,208 --> 01:04:36,458 I mean, that's the kind of experience I have 923 01:04:36,458 --> 01:04:40,333 with generals back in 1968 when right before 924 01:04:40,333 --> 01:04:42,750 for Tet Attack we predicted 925 01:04:42,750 --> 01:04:45,500 which touched on the previous two months. 926 01:04:54,291 --> 01:04:56,958 Some people come to me and show some reports 927 01:04:56,958 --> 01:05:01,041 on activities in Vietnam, 928 01:05:01,041 --> 01:05:04,000 and they say that they are preparing a major attack 929 01:05:04,000 --> 01:05:08,125 who will go from the delta to northern Vietnam. 930 01:05:08,125 --> 01:05:11,083 That was all reported to all the main commanders in the field 931 01:05:11,083 --> 01:05:15,333 as well as the pentagon and everyone, 932 01:05:15,333 --> 01:05:20,291 but no one in the position of authority pays attention to it. 933 01:05:22,625 --> 01:05:26,166 General Westmoreland once again said to people 934 01:05:22,625 --> 01:05:26,166 in the United States 935 01:05:26,166 --> 01:05:27,750 that we won. 936 01:05:27,750 --> 01:05:30,958 We watch the situation carefully. 937 01:05:30,958 --> 01:05:36,125 And I'm sure that there are further initiatives 938 01:05:30,958 --> 01:05:36,125 can be blunted. 939 01:05:38,791 --> 01:05:41,041 [Binney] I basically see that as 940 01:05:41,041 --> 01:05:43,833 a philosophy of arrogance of power. 941 01:05:45,916 --> 01:05:49,958 They feel they have so much power that they are invincible. 942 01:05:55,291 --> 01:05:59,458 I have friends who are stationed in Vietnam. 943 01:05:59,458 --> 01:06:02,833 One colonel I know has a battalion 944 01:06:02,833 --> 01:06:06,083 placed on the road from Saigon to Cambodia, 945 01:06:06,083 --> 01:06:08,458 which is the main point of attack. 946 01:06:12,125 --> 01:06:14,041 He, of course, has a report too. 947 01:06:14,041 --> 01:06:20,041 So he has 50% of his men in the trench all the time, 948 01:06:20,041 --> 01:06:22,208 24 hours a day... 949 01:06:24,125 --> 01:06:26,291 Until the attack. 950 01:06:29,250 --> 01:06:34,125 He is ready, and he loses one person 951 01:06:29,250 --> 01:06:34,125 on the first day, 952 01:06:34,125 --> 01:06:36,916 and he stopped it cold. 953 01:06:42,708 --> 01:06:45,708 The problem is all the forces on both sides 954 01:06:45,708 --> 01:06:49,458 have fallen back because they can't resist 955 01:06:45,708 --> 01:06:49,458 their position on the phone 956 01:06:49,458 --> 01:06:51,083 because they are not ready yet. 957 01:06:51,083 --> 01:06:53,541 They don't listen to intelligence. 958 01:06:53,541 --> 01:06:56,041 So he finally had to retreat. 959 01:07:00,750 --> 01:07:02,666 The point is if they are ready, 960 01:07:02,666 --> 01:07:06,166 the offensive will get a place at all, 961 01:07:06,166 --> 01:07:09,333 but they don't pay attention. 962 01:07:09,333 --> 01:07:10,791 This is a trick and dangerous actions by enemies. 963 01:07:10,791 --> 01:07:15,208 [Binney] We think they're all idiots. 964 01:07:15,208 --> 01:07:17,625 I think every general in the country must be fired 965 01:07:17,625 --> 01:07:23,125 after the attack. 966 01:07:17,625 --> 01:07:23,125 All of them. 967 01:07:23,125 --> 01:07:25,291 They should be derived from services. 968 01:07:28,958 --> 01:07:31,166 I mean, we got rid of the generals and all that during World War II for very similar types of omission, 969 01:07:31,166 --> 01:07:33,708 970 01:07:33,708 --> 01:07:36,083 971 01:07:36,083 --> 01:07:40,250 so I don't understand why we don't get rid of it. 972 01:07:42,375 --> 01:07:46,166 And in the case of Americans, I think there's a little 973 01:07:42,375 --> 01:07:46,166 more than 2,000 lives are lost 974 01:07:46,166 --> 01:07:49,083 in the attack. 975 01:07:49,083 --> 01:07:52,458 It doesn't count how many are injured. 976 01:07:55,375 --> 01:07:57,291 That's why I saw it when they treated us 977 01:07:57,291 --> 01:08:00,333 only meat on the line. 978 01:08:00,333 --> 01:08:03,000 You know, throw more meat on the line. 979 01:08:28,041 --> 01:08:30,041 We started our special coverage tonight 980 01:08:30,041 --> 01:08:31,791 with the latest about terror attacks 981 01:08:31,791 --> 01:08:34,791 against US-guided Cole missile destroyers. 982 01:08:34,791 --> 01:08:37,458 The Navy says it has found the bodies of seven sailors and is looking for a ruined interior 983 01:08:37,458 --> 01:08:41,541 ship for ten more people. 984 01:08:37,458 --> 01:08:41,541 About 35 other sailors were injured. 985 01:08:41,541 --> 01:08:44,125 [newscaster] In the bleak weather 986 01:08:47,000 --> 01:08:49,125 adjust the opportunity, 987 01:08:47,000 --> 01:08:49,125 the first body of a sailor killed the Cole ship 988 01:08:49,125 --> 01:08:51,666 989 01:08:51,666 --> 01:08:54,208 arrived in Germany this afternoon. 990 01:08:54,208 --> 01:08:55,708 The explosion that claimed their lives 991 01:08:55,708 --> 01:08:57,375 estimated to have happened 992 01:08:57,375 --> 01:08:59,583 by several hundred pounds of explosives 993 01:08:59,583 --> 01:09:03,083 in new and deadly terrorist tactics. 994 01:09:05,375 --> 01:09:07,291 [newscaster] Immediately after the attack 995 01:09:07,291 --> 01:09:10,208 there is nothing left from the small local port craft 996 01:09:10,208 --> 01:09:13,208 which the navy said was carrying explosives. 997 01:09:13,208 --> 01:09:16,000 Despite instability in the nearest area, 998 01:09:16,000 --> 01:09:20,416 Aden strategic port has been used as a fuel stop place 999 01:09:16,000 --> 01:09:20,416 for two years 1000 01:09:20,416 --> 01:09:23,500 and Cole are in a high alert state. 1001 01:09:23,500 --> 01:09:25,833 But there seems to be no defense 1002 01:09:25,833 --> 01:09:29,125 against suicide bombers in small boats. 1003 01:09:49,666 --> 01:09:53,958 [Binney] We decided to continue 1004 01:09:49,666 --> 01:09:53,958 develop ThinThread 1005 01:09:53,958 --> 01:09:57,083 to try to make sure we have something that will 1006 01:09:53,958 --> 01:09:57,083 functions functionally 1007 01:09:57,083 --> 01:09:59,250 at the end of 2000 1008 01:09:59,250 --> 01:10:02,708 so we can overcome the problem of terrorism 1009 01:09:59,250 --> 01:10:02,708 in the real world, not in the world of desires 1010 01:10:02,708 --> 01:10:06,166 from Trailblazer, for example. 1011 01:10:11,541 --> 01:10:14,250 That's when I went to our terrorism analysis center 1012 01:10:14,250 --> 01:10:17,208 and say, "okay, what site do you have that will-- 1013 01:10:17,208 --> 01:10:19,875 that produces information that means to you 1014 01:10:19,875 --> 01:10:22,166 to analyze terrorism targets around the world?" 1015 01:10:22,166 --> 01:10:24,583 So they gave me a list of 18 sites, 1016 01:10:24,583 --> 01:10:28,083 so I took it as a target set to fight terrorism. 1017 01:10:28,083 --> 01:10:30,291 And then I came in November 2000 1018 01:10:30,291 --> 01:10:34,250 and make a proposal that we did ThinThread 1019 01:10:34,250 --> 01:10:38,750 to 18 sites began in January 2001. 1020 01:10:42,041 --> 01:10:45,208 But it was rejected again. 1021 01:10:47,166 --> 01:10:49,125 So I don't know exactly who refused it. 1022 01:10:49,125 --> 01:10:53,583 I assume it is the head of SID, Maureen Baginski. 1023 01:10:53,583 --> 01:10:58,708 He is the third person in the ranking in the agency. 1024 01:10:58,708 --> 01:11:02,291 There is a director, deputy director, then he. 1025 01:11:09,125 --> 01:11:12,083 [Loomis] General Hayden 1026 01:11:09,125 --> 01:11:12,083 hire Bill Black 1027 01:11:12,083 --> 01:11:17,250 to come and take over the position of deputy director. 1028 01:11:17,250 --> 01:11:22,375 After Bill Black is taken from SAIC, 1029 01:11:22,375 --> 01:11:25,458 where he became vice president, 1030 01:11:25,458 --> 01:11:27,791 next spring, he brings 1031 01:11:27,791 --> 01:11:32,166 Other senior vice presidents of SAIC, 1032 01:11:32,166 --> 01:11:36,583 and that person is Sam Visner. 1033 01:11:36,583 --> 01:11:42,083 And who gets a contract to develop a Trailblazer? 1034 01:11:42,083 --> 01:11:45,583 SAIC. 1035 01:11:45,583 --> 01:11:48,125 What's wrong with this photo? 1036 01:11:50,250 --> 01:11:52,750 [Binney] SAIC is a private company. 1037 01:11:52,750 --> 01:11:57,125 This is made basically from NSA individuals who retire. 1038 01:11:57,125 --> 01:12:01,166 People from the NSA retire and they will enter the company 1039 01:11:57,125 --> 01:12:01,166 like SAIC, 1040 01:12:01,166 --> 01:12:04,125 and then they will use their contacts again at the NSA 1041 01:12:04,125 --> 01:12:07,583 to get the contract back to SAIC. 1042 01:12:12,583 --> 01:12:14,708 So when Sam Visner came to take over 1043 01:12:14,708 --> 01:12:16,625 NSA transformation office, 1044 01:12:16,625 --> 01:12:20,291 the first thing he did was call me to his office. 1045 01:12:20,291 --> 01:12:22,208 So I went to his office to talk to him, 1046 01:12:22,208 --> 01:12:24,333 and when I go in there, senior developer 1047 01:12:24,333 --> 01:12:26,583 for the Trailblazer program there. 1048 01:12:26,583 --> 01:12:29,000 And the first thing Sam told me, 1049 01:12:29,000 --> 01:12:34,666 he said, "I don't want you to briefing ThinThread 1050 01:12:29,000 --> 01:12:34,666 to anyone else." 1051 01:12:34,666 --> 01:12:36,500 And the reason he said that, of course, 1052 01:12:36,500 --> 01:12:38,875 because we have made an appointment 1053 01:12:38,875 --> 01:12:41,083 to explain Charlie Allen. 1054 01:12:41,083 --> 01:12:43,041 He is a senior collection officer 1055 01:12:43,041 --> 01:12:44,458 for the intelligence community, 1056 01:12:44,458 --> 01:12:47,083 so he has a lot of influence. 1057 01:12:47,083 --> 01:12:51,125 So I asked him if he wanted me to cancel the appointment, 1058 01:12:51,125 --> 01:12:52,750 and he said, "no, no, don't do that. 1059 01:12:52,750 --> 01:12:54,208 You go ahead and finish the briefing." 1060 01:12:54,208 --> 01:12:56,291 I say, "okay, I'll do it." 1061 01:12:56,291 --> 01:12:58,208 When Charlie Allen goes in there, 1062 01:12:58,208 --> 01:13:00,291 the first thing he sat down and said to us, 1063 01:13:00,291 --> 01:13:03,583 before we even start showing anything about ThinThread, 1064 01:13:03,583 --> 01:13:06,875 he said, "I heard you have a cheap Trailblazer here, 1065 01:13:06,875 --> 01:13:09,125 and I'm here to see it." 1066 01:13:09,125 --> 01:13:10,916 Well, I mean, I was invited. 1067 01:13:10,916 --> 01:13:12,375 Maureen Baginski appears 1068 01:13:12,375 --> 01:13:13,833 Because Maureen knows Charlie Allen. 1069 01:13:13,833 --> 01:13:15,875 They are friends for a long time-- 1070 01:13:15,875 --> 01:13:18,041 they have known each other for several years, I think. 1071 01:13:18,041 --> 01:13:20,083 And he was there, and he said-- 1072 01:13:20,083 --> 01:13:22,416 at that time, he said, "yes, Charlie, 1073 01:13:22,416 --> 01:13:24,833 but we still need money." 1074 01:13:26,375 --> 01:13:29,791 That is the end of our briefing on ThinThread. 1075 01:13:37,041 --> 01:13:41,208 [Loomis] On August 20, 2001, 1076 01:13:41,208 --> 01:13:47,041 Maureen baginski called me and asked to talk to me 1077 01:13:41,208 --> 01:13:47,041 and Bill Binney 1078 01:13:47,041 --> 01:13:49,875 4:30 that afternoon. 1079 01:13:49,875 --> 01:13:53,333 And he said to meet him in his office, 1080 01:13:53,333 --> 01:13:56,041 So Bill and I go to his office. 1081 01:13:56,041 --> 01:14:00,708 And in this meeting with him he advised us 1082 01:14:00,708 --> 01:14:03,666 that he ends ThinThread. 1083 01:14:03,666 --> 01:14:08,083 And he said that the decision was made because 1084 01:14:08,083 --> 01:14:09,666 he must decide whether or not 1085 01:14:09,666 --> 01:14:12,208 he wants to make six people unhappy 1086 01:14:12,208 --> 01:14:15,041 or nearly 500 unhappy. 1087 01:14:15,041 --> 01:14:18,500 So he chose to make the six people unhappy. 1088 01:14:18,500 --> 01:14:22,041 So the decision is what I basically call 1089 01:14:22,041 --> 01:14:24,333 happiness management. 1090 01:14:35,416 --> 01:14:37,583 [newscaster] They let us stay awake. 1091 01:14:35,416 --> 01:14:37,583 I'm not sure why. 1092 01:14:37,583 --> 01:14:39,875 Newark allows us to stay awake. 1093 01:14:39,875 --> 01:14:44,000 We-- only news helicopters are allowed to ride 1094 01:14:39,875 --> 01:14:44,000 from all over the country. 1095 01:14:44,000 --> 01:14:47,083 We, like, five people in the air, that's all. 1096 01:14:57,041 --> 01:14:59,416 Oh God, what happened? 1097 01:15:01,833 --> 01:15:04,958 It's like the side of the building exploding, Chad, 1098 01:15:01,833 --> 01:15:04,958 on the other side. 1099 01:15:04,958 --> 01:15:07,166 The side we can't see. 1100 01:15:07,166 --> 01:15:09,458 Look at that. 1101 01:15:15,875 --> 01:15:19,166 Oh my God! 1102 01:15:19,166 --> 01:15:21,083 The entire tower collapses. 1103 01:15:21,083 --> 01:15:24,541 The whole building is gone. Entire building. 1104 01:15:25,791 --> 01:15:27,708 Oh! 1105 01:15:35,458 --> 01:15:38,125 Daniela, did you hear me? The entire building collapsed. 1106 01:15:38,125 --> 01:15:40,458 It's gone. 1107 01:16:01,500 --> 01:16:03,916 The second tower is missing. 1108 01:16:23,625 --> 01:16:26,291 Oh, those poor people. Oh, my God. 1109 01:16:30,125 --> 01:16:33,291 On 9/11, I had taken my father-in-law 1110 01:16:33,291 --> 01:16:35,416 to an ophthalmologist for examination, 1111 01:16:35,416 --> 01:16:39,083 so I sit in the waiting room 1112 01:16:35,416 --> 01:16:39,083 watching television 1113 01:16:39,083 --> 01:16:41,708 when he was examined. 1114 01:16:41,708 --> 01:16:44,541 And that's when I saw the first plane 1115 01:16:44,541 --> 01:16:48,125 tap the tower in New York. 1116 01:16:48,125 --> 01:16:51,166 And soon it's said to me 1117 01:16:51,166 --> 01:16:54,125 that we as agents failed to warn 1118 01:16:54,125 --> 01:16:57,541 from this terrorist attack. 1119 01:17:18,875 --> 01:17:21,208 When my father-in-law finishes the examination, 1120 01:17:21,208 --> 01:17:24,208 I took it home and then tried to return to NSA 1121 01:17:24,208 --> 01:17:25,750 to see what I can do 1122 01:17:25,750 --> 01:17:29,583 to help get information 1123 01:17:29,583 --> 01:17:31,916 about who does this and all. 1124 01:17:31,916 --> 01:17:35,625 And they won't let me back just because 1125 01:17:35,625 --> 01:17:38,250 Director Hayden has sent everyone home 1126 01:17:38,250 --> 01:17:40,375 that is not needed for the job, 1127 01:17:40,375 --> 01:17:43,041 and the guards keep everyone out, 1128 01:17:43,041 --> 01:17:45,666 so we can't go back that day. 1129 01:17:45,666 --> 01:17:47,541 So the day after 9/11, 1130 01:17:47,541 --> 01:17:51,125 I come dressed as I will sweep the floor, 1131 01:17:51,125 --> 01:17:52,916 So the guards let me enter 1132 01:17:52,916 --> 01:17:54,791 Otherwise they will get me out too, 1133 01:17:54,791 --> 01:17:57,250 because of that day, 1134 01:17:57,250 --> 01:17:59,750 General Hayden has ordered everyone out 1135 01:17:57,250 --> 01:17:59,750 from the building too. 1136 01:17:59,750 --> 01:18:03,500 So when I go in there, I go to SARC 1137 01:18:03,500 --> 01:18:09,750 And while there trying to see the material 1138 01:18:03,500 --> 01:18:09,750 on my computer, 1139 01:18:09,750 --> 01:18:12,166 contracting-- I'm 1140 01:18:12,166 --> 01:18:14,333 president of the contract group 1141 01:18:14,333 --> 01:18:16,500 which I worked on ThinThread 1142 01:18:16,500 --> 01:18:18,500 come to me and say that he just 1143 01:18:18,500 --> 01:18:21,500 in a contractor meeting with Sam Visner. 1144 01:18:21,500 --> 01:18:27,333 And at that meeting, Sam Visner told him that... 1145 01:18:27,333 --> 01:18:32,083 he said to him, "don't embarrass big companies. 1146 01:18:32,083 --> 01:18:34,291 you do your part, you will get your share. 1147 01:18:34,291 --> 01:18:36,666 There is a lot for everyone." 1148 01:18:40,500 --> 01:18:43,875 And he also said that Sam had said that, 1149 01:18:43,875 --> 01:18:47,333 "We can milk this cow for 15 years." 1150 01:18:50,125 --> 01:18:53,916 We started going to the world of work 1151 01:18:55,250 --> 01:18:59,541 and I will accompany Maureen Baginski. 1152 01:18:59,541 --> 01:19:04,333 Workforce is very extraordinary hard. 1153 01:19:04,333 --> 01:19:08,125 People will ask him, "what will you do?" 1154 01:19:08,125 --> 01:19:10,291 I still remember him saying, 1155 01:19:10,291 --> 01:19:14,416 "9/11 is a gift for the NSA. 1156 01:19:14,416 --> 01:19:17,083 We will get all the money we need and then some." 1157 01:19:17,083 --> 01:19:18,833 Direct quote. 1158 01:19:23,416 --> 01:19:26,958 "9/11 is a gift for the NSA." 1159 01:19:26,958 --> 01:19:31,083 All he saw was a dollar that came from Congress, 1160 01:19:31,083 --> 01:19:34,916 and we will spend it freely. 1161 01:19:34,916 --> 01:19:37,958 [Binney] That's not 1162 01:19:34,916 --> 01:19:37,958 we should be. 1163 01:19:37,958 --> 01:19:39,583 It's not about making money, 1164 01:19:39,583 --> 01:19:41,125 it's about protecting the country 1165 01:19:41,125 --> 01:19:43,125 and free world. That isn't-- You know, 1166 01:19:45,125 --> 01:19:47,250 not how big the kingdom we can build 1167 01:19:47,250 --> 01:19:49,666 or how much money can we make, huh? 1168 01:19:52,166 --> 01:19:54,458 That's just sickening. 1169 01:20:00,416 --> 01:20:02,958 In late September or early October, 1170 01:20:02,958 --> 01:20:08,291 we at SARC watched all this 1171 01:20:02,958 --> 01:20:08,291 equipment starts to arrive 1172 01:20:08,291 --> 01:20:11,083 and piled up in the hallway and outside SARC 1173 01:20:11,083 --> 01:20:13,875 and inside SARC on the path 1174 01:20:13,875 --> 01:20:16,875 between partitions for a table. 1175 01:20:16,875 --> 01:20:20,791 We know something happened because of all this equipment 1176 01:20:16,875 --> 01:20:20,791 enter. 1177 01:20:20,791 --> 01:20:23,750 And then in early October, 1178 01:20:23,750 --> 01:20:25,458 it starts to disappear. 1179 01:20:25,458 --> 01:20:27,458 That means they are assembling hardware 1180 01:20:27,458 --> 01:20:29,625 somewhere in the corridor 1181 01:20:29,625 --> 01:20:33,250 a little down from our place. 1182 01:20:33,250 --> 01:20:37,250 And then in mid-October, the second week in October, 1183 01:20:37,250 --> 01:20:39,791 some people who used to do that-- 1184 01:20:39,791 --> 01:20:43,583 I am under contract to do software for us at SARC, 1185 01:20:43,583 --> 01:20:47,166 come to me and say that, 1186 01:20:47,166 --> 01:20:49,541 "Do you know what they are doing there? 1187 01:20:49,541 --> 01:20:55,958 They take data on every US citizen in this country." 1188 01:21:04,333 --> 01:21:06,708 To do espionage on US citizens, 1189 01:21:06,708 --> 01:21:11,083 they must use the only software that is managed 1190 01:21:06,708 --> 01:21:11,083 large-scale operations, 1191 01:21:11,083 --> 01:21:13,541 which is the software that I put together, 1192 01:21:13,541 --> 01:21:15,291 which is the backend of ThinThread, 1193 01:21:15,291 --> 01:21:16,791 the part that does the graph 1194 01:21:16,791 --> 01:21:18,166 and information management 1195 01:21:18,166 --> 01:21:19,791 index to graph. 1196 01:21:19,791 --> 01:21:22,166 And one of the first things they do 1197 01:21:22,166 --> 01:21:25,875 to make the process work efficiently, of course, 1198 01:21:22,166 --> 01:21:25,875 According to them, 1199 01:21:25,875 --> 01:21:31,541 is deleting all encryption algorithms 1200 01:21:25,875 --> 01:21:31,541 we put it in... 1201 01:21:33,000 --> 01:21:35,875 To protect privacy and identity rights 1202 01:21:35,875 --> 01:21:40,333 US citizens or other citizens 1203 01:21:35,875 --> 01:21:40,333 in that database. 1204 01:21:40,333 --> 01:21:42,708 Well, I mean, after I was told 1205 01:21:42,708 --> 01:21:45,125 that they draw all this data to US citizens 1206 01:21:45,125 --> 01:21:47,625 and basically graph relationships 1207 01:21:47,625 --> 01:21:52,083 every US citizen who uses the telephone 1208 01:21:47,625 --> 01:21:52,083 or whatever electronics, 1209 01:21:52,083 --> 01:21:55,791 well I - it's clear to me that I have to leave the agency. 1210 01:21:55,791 --> 01:21:58,791 I can't live there, so I have to get out 1211 01:21:55,791 --> 01:21:58,791 as fast as I can. 1212 01:21:58,791 --> 01:22:03,166 Bill, Ed, and Kirk become very disgusted with all the resistance they get, 1213 01:22:03,166 --> 01:22:06,083 and with some personal attacks against them, 1214 01:22:06,083 --> 01:22:09,916 I think too, 1215 01:22:06,083 --> 01:22:09,916 that they decide to take the offer to retire 1216 01:22:09,916 --> 01:22:14,250 at the end of October, 1217 01:22:14,250 --> 01:22:16,166 and they told me that they planned to do that. 1218 01:22:16,166 --> 01:22:19,875 Our last breath at the NSA was October 31, 2001. 1219 01:22:19,875 --> 01:22:25,500 Halloween Day. Right type. 1220 01:22:25,500 --> 01:22:28,291 [Binney] After 9/11, 1221 01:22:59,375 --> 01:23:02,208 and after we leave, 1222 01:22:59,375 --> 01:23:02,208 1223 01:23:02,208 --> 01:23:05,666 Tom takes over ThinThread. 1224 01:23:09,000 --> 01:23:14,291 And he said, "well, let's take the software 1225 01:23:09,000 --> 01:23:14,291 on ThinThread 1226 01:23:14,291 --> 01:23:17,083 and run it on the database 1227 01:23:17,083 --> 01:23:19,625 which we have accumulated in the NSA 1228 01:23:19,625 --> 01:23:23,291 to find out if there is information about the 9/11 attacks 1229 01:23:23,291 --> 01:23:26,666 that we should know, but not. 1230 01:23:30,000 --> 01:23:35,041 [Drake] We let it run... somewhere 1231 01:23:30,000 --> 01:23:35,041 around 24 to 36 hours. and they just destroy. 1232 01:23:38,250 --> 01:23:40,166 We find critical intelligence, 1233 01:23:40,166 --> 01:23:43,791 Al-Qaeda and intelligence associations 1234 01:23:43,791 --> 01:23:47,208 movements that the NSA has never found. 1235 01:23:48,375 --> 01:23:51,125 They don't even know they have it in their database. 1236 01:23:51,125 --> 01:23:53,083 = = But also the specific details 1237 01:23:53,083 --> 01:23:54,958 numbers and movements 1238 01:23:54,958 --> 01:23:58,458 and time and location-- 1239 01:24:03,041 --> 01:24:07,875 travel. 1240 01:24:07,875 --> 01:24:11,000 1241 01:24:11,000 --> 01:24:14,541 1242 01:24:14,541 --> 01:24:17,125 1243 01:24:17,125 --> 01:24:20,125 And you see the pattern of spread 1244 01:24:20,125 --> 01:24:23,041 that happens after that happens. 1245 01:24:23,041 --> 01:24:25,416 You also see that there is a part of the plot 1246 01:24:25,416 --> 01:24:28,833 where they are not successful. 1247 01:24:30,375 --> 01:24:33,041 There are several aircraft that are targeted. 1248 01:24:33,041 --> 01:24:35,833 And for a number of reasons, 1249 01:24:35,833 --> 01:24:39,583 the planes were not really hijacked. 1250 01:24:44,625 --> 01:24:48,125 You can imagine the horror of making it happen 1251 01:24:48,125 --> 01:24:50,416 what hasn't been found 1252 01:24:50,416 --> 01:24:54,000 and confirm what is known 1253 01:24:54,000 --> 01:24:56,166 sit in this database. 1254 01:25:00,333 --> 01:25:05,250 What if this was discovered before 9/11? 1255 01:25:05,250 --> 01:25:09,708 We have information in the database. 1256 01:25:12,875 --> 01:25:14,333 NSA response? 1257 01:25:14,333 --> 01:25:16,083 Close the program completely. 1258 01:25:25,583 --> 01:25:28,041 [Roark] 9/11 will be avoided. 1259 01:25:28,041 --> 01:25:30,541 We will catch people 1260 01:25:30,541 --> 01:25:34,041 who communicates from San Diego 1261 01:25:34,041 --> 01:25:37,416 with people abroad, with terrorists known abroad. 1262 01:25:37,416 --> 01:25:39,541 There's no way we won't catch it. 1263 01:25:53,125 --> 01:25:57,041 [Binney] After Ed and Kirk 1264 01:25:53,125 --> 01:25:57,041 and I left the NSA, 1265 01:25:57,041 --> 01:26:00,041 we formed a small company, a consulting company 1266 01:26:00,041 --> 01:26:03,041 we are called Entity Mapping, LLC. 1267 01:26:03,041 --> 01:26:08,500 We decided to try to present the ThinThread 1268 01:26:08,500 --> 01:26:11,000 concept to other agents and governments 1269 01:26:11,000 --> 01:26:14,750 and bring it to the US government 1270 01:26:11,000 --> 01:26:14,750 through another door. 1271 01:26:17,708 --> 01:26:19,458 [Binney] We were asked by 1272 01:26:19,458 --> 01:26:21,208 Senate Intelligence Committee staff 1273 01:26:21,208 --> 01:26:24,166 to go to the National Reconnaissance Office. 1274 01:26:24,166 --> 01:26:29,208 They manage all satellites and reconnaissance 1275 01:26:24,166 --> 01:26:29,208 type of mission. 1276 01:26:29,208 --> 01:26:31,166 We are working there on a program, 1277 01:26:31,166 --> 01:26:33,500 but NSA knows about that. 1278 01:26:33,500 --> 01:26:36,958 They get all programs stopped. 1279 01:26:40,500 --> 01:26:44,083 Then we go to customs and border protection. 1280 01:26:44,083 --> 01:26:48,083 They got us fired from that one. 1281 01:26:48,083 --> 01:26:50,791 Bill and Kirk are very angry at all times 1282 01:26:50,791 --> 01:26:56,333 we go to get a contract with a promising customer, 1283 01:26:56,333 --> 01:26:59,750 at the last minute, it will be turned off. 1284 01:26:59,750 --> 01:27:02,208 It happened with INSCOM, it happened with the pentagon, 1285 01:27:02,208 --> 01:27:06,166 that happens with NRO, it happens with the CIA. 1286 01:27:06,166 --> 01:27:10,208 We stop at each of them, 1287 01:27:10,208 --> 01:27:14,041 even though it works. 1288 01:27:14,041 --> 01:27:16,166 - OK, I think we understand. - Yes 1289 01:27:16,166 --> 01:27:19,625 [Wiebe] Includes one 1290 01:27:19,625 --> 01:27:23,958 where we are given a data set 1291 01:27:23,958 --> 01:27:26,041 and asked to analyze it 1292 01:27:26,041 --> 01:27:29,916 even though the NSA has analyzed it. 1293 01:27:29,916 --> 01:27:34,291 We found very valuable material in that data 1294 01:27:34,291 --> 01:27:36,500 where NSA doesn't. 1295 01:27:36,500 --> 01:27:41,083 We write reports, send them to the chain. 1296 01:27:41,083 --> 01:27:43,666 A senior executive at the agency said, 1297 01:27:43,666 --> 01:27:48,333 "Oh my God, these people will embarrass Michael Hayden 1298 01:27:48,333 --> 01:27:50,250 and the people in the castle. 1299 01:27:50,250 --> 01:27:52,458 We have to stop this program." 1300 01:27:52,458 --> 01:27:56,375 And that stops immediately. We were told to stop working. 1301 01:27:56,375 --> 01:27:58,041 Don't do anything else. 1302 01:27:58,041 --> 01:28:01,125 And they started to dismantle the computer 1303 01:28:01,125 --> 01:28:02,625 that we do 1304 01:28:02,625 --> 01:28:05,416 and the data we found 1305 01:28:05,416 --> 01:28:08,250 and all intelligence 1306 01:28:08,250 --> 01:28:11,666 removed from disk. 1307 01:28:21,500 --> 01:28:24,541 [Binney] The NSA is trying to defend it 1308 01:28:21,500 --> 01:28:24,541 ThinThread principles 1309 01:28:24,541 --> 01:28:27,208 is being applied anywhere in the US government 1310 01:28:27,208 --> 01:28:29,125 so there are no other agents in the US government 1311 01:28:29,125 --> 01:28:31,041 can use it too. 1312 01:28:31,041 --> 01:28:34,416 So in essence, they want to maintain the US population 1313 01:28:34,416 --> 01:28:36,916 and vulnerable free world population, 1314 01:28:36,916 --> 01:28:39,041 that's what they do. 1315 01:28:42,875 --> 01:28:46,208 And that's why we filed an IG DoD complaint in September 2002 against NSA 1316 01:28:46,208 --> 01:28:50,083 for corruption, fraud, waste, and abuse. 1317 01:28:50,083 --> 01:28:53,291 [Loomis] Kirk arranges it 1318 01:28:59,041 --> 01:29:04,416 very strong fraud complaints 1319 01:28:59,041 --> 01:29:04,416 1320 01:29:04,416 --> 01:29:07,250 and we say, "let's do it." 1321 01:29:07,250 --> 01:29:10,166 And Diane is also a party in this matter. 1322 01:29:10,166 --> 01:29:12,083 He agreed to join. 1323 01:29:12,083 --> 01:29:16,041 So there's Kirk, Bill, Diane, and myself, 1324 01:29:16,041 --> 01:29:20,166 and then Kirk really floats this by Tom Drake. 1325 01:29:20,166 --> 01:29:22,083 I am not aware that he, 1326 01:29:22,083 --> 01:29:23,875 but he shared with Tom Drake. 1327 01:29:23,875 --> 01:29:27,125 And Tom, because he still works at the NSA, 1328 01:29:27,125 --> 01:29:31,750 says that he will support us from within. 1329 01:29:34,333 --> 01:29:38,916 [Drake] I have access 1330 01:29:34,333 --> 01:29:38,916 for important information 1331 01:29:38,916 --> 01:29:43,166 which is clear NSA is hiding. 1332 01:29:43,166 --> 01:29:45,833 Because of all these investigations 1333 01:29:43,166 --> 01:29:45,833 in progress, 1334 01:29:45,833 --> 01:29:49,041 NSA says, "let's find out where the framework is, 1335 01:29:49,041 --> 01:29:53,250 catch everything, and then bury the report 1336 01:29:49,041 --> 01:29:53,250 as deep as possible." 1337 01:29:53,250 --> 01:29:55,625 This is actually something that Bill Black, 1338 01:29:55,625 --> 01:29:59,291 deputy director, do it. 1339 01:29:59,291 --> 01:30:00,750 And the order comes out, 1340 01:30:00,750 --> 01:30:04,166 "No one will see the report. 1341 01:30:04,166 --> 01:30:07,000 We can't show anyone 1342 01:30:07,000 --> 01:30:11,416 what ThinThread found that we haven't found. 1343 01:30:11,416 --> 01:30:15,541 We can't show ThinThread confirmed 1344 01:30:15,541 --> 01:30:18,958 what is clearly a failure . " 1345 01:30:23,041 --> 01:30:26,000 So I was officially contacted 1346 01:30:26,000 --> 01:30:30,000 and settings made for me to meet 1347 01:30:26,000 --> 01:30:30,000 with researchers. 1348 01:30:34,458 --> 01:30:37,583 And the DoD IG office is investigating that. 1349 01:30:37,583 --> 01:30:39,916 with around 12 researchers, 1350 01:30:39,916 --> 01:30:42,750 and take them about two and a half years to do it. 1351 01:30:42,750 --> 01:30:44,458 They finally publish their report 1352 01:30:44,458 --> 01:30:47,875 at, I think that, January 2005. 1353 01:30:47,875 --> 01:30:52,083 And at that time, about 98% of them were edited because it is very damaging to the NSA. 1354 01:30:52,083 --> 01:30:55,541 [Loomis] Many of the editors 1355 01:31:07,250 --> 01:31:09,708 is in paragraph 1356 01:31:07,250 --> 01:31:09,708 marked is not classified. 1357 01:31:09,708 --> 01:31:12,041 1358 01:31:14,833 --> 01:31:16,666 So it's clear to me 1359 01:31:16,666 --> 01:31:21,125 that dirty laundry is destroyed. 1360 01:31:23,083 --> 01:31:27,416 [Binney] This is our judicial department 1361 01:31:23,083 --> 01:31:27,416 cover up for those crimes. 1362 01:31:35,583 --> 01:31:37,541 [Wiebe] In 2005, 1363 01:31:37,541 --> 01:31:42,083 Trailblazer is declared a total failure, 1364 01:31:42,083 --> 01:31:46,375 spend billions of dollars. 1365 01:31:46,375 --> 01:31:49,666 Many millionaires were made during that time, 1366 01:31:49,666 --> 01:31:53,666 but not much intelligence is done. 1367 01:31:53,666 --> 01:31:59,916 That was the biggest failure in NSA history. 1368 01:31:59,916 --> 01:32:02,125 People don't realize it. 1369 01:32:02,125 --> 01:32:04,000 However, Hayden general, 1370 01:32:04,000 --> 01:32:08,458 who led the biggest failure in NSA history, 1371 01:32:08,458 --> 01:32:12,875 promoted to a higher authority position, 1372 01:32:12,875 --> 01:32:16,541 make a deputy director of National Intelligence, 1373 01:32:16,541 --> 01:32:19,166 and then promoted again 1374 01:32:19,166 --> 01:32:23,083 and become director of Central Intelligence. 1375 01:32:23,083 --> 01:32:27,791 Very strange when humanity promotes failure. 1376 01:32:27,791 --> 01:32:29,958 Something is wrong. 1377 01:32:36,166 --> 01:32:39,083 On July 26, 2007, 1378 01:32:39,083 --> 01:32:41,333 The FBI decided to attack four people. 1379 01:32:41,333 --> 01:32:44,166 That is Kirk Weibe, Ed Loomis, 1380 01:32:44,166 --> 01:32:46,083 Diane Roark, and myself. 1381 01:32:50,958 --> 01:32:52,458 So they fabricate evidence 1382 01:32:52,458 --> 01:32:55,208 to get a warrant signed by the judge 1383 01:32:55,208 --> 01:32:58,208 to enter and attack our home and take our material. 1384 01:32:58,208 --> 01:33:01,416 In particular, they are all 1385 01:33:01,416 --> 01:33:03,875 material related to ThinThread. 1386 01:33:09,500 --> 01:33:11,166 My child opens the door and lets them in, 1387 01:33:11,166 --> 01:33:12,833 and they come with their weapons pulled 1388 01:33:12,833 --> 01:33:14,875 and push it out of the way at gunpoint, 1389 01:33:14,875 --> 01:33:17,125 and come to the bedroom where my wife is dressed 1390 01:33:17,125 --> 01:33:19,041 and direct the gun towards him, and then enter the bathroom 1391 01:33:19,041 --> 01:33:22,916 where I take a shower and point a gun at me. 1392 01:33:28,666 --> 01:33:31,750 I didn't hear them at first, apparently. 1393 01:33:31,750 --> 01:33:33,666 When I hear it, 1394 01:33:33,666 --> 01:33:35,875 sounds like they will break the door. 1395 01:33:35,875 --> 01:33:40,083 They shake it wildly and slam it forward and back. 1396 01:33:40,083 --> 01:33:42,041 When the attack occurs here, 1397 01:33:42,041 --> 01:33:46,208 it is very surprising to my inner core. 1398 01:33:46,208 --> 01:33:49,333 I don't believe that happened. 1399 01:33:49,333 --> 01:33:52,250 [Roark] I went to call 1400 01:33:49,333 --> 01:33:52,250 My first lawyer. 1401 01:33:52,250 --> 01:33:54,041 He told me to request a statement 1402 01:33:54,041 --> 01:33:56,166 that justifies the attack. 1403 01:33:56,166 --> 01:33:59,000 I ask them, they say it's secret 1404 01:33:56,166 --> 01:33:59,000 and I can't see it. 1405 01:33:59,000 --> 01:34:02,416 As soon as I hang up, I realize they have gone 1406 01:33:59,000 --> 01:34:02,416 to office 1407 01:34:02,416 --> 01:34:06,666 and retrieve all the most relevant information, 1408 01:34:06,666 --> 01:34:10,083 all the things about the NSA on the shelf, 1409 01:34:10,083 --> 01:34:12,625 which, I think, is the first indication 1410 01:34:12,625 --> 01:34:15,958 that they have entered the house before. 1411 01:34:15,958 --> 01:34:20,666 When all the equipment is taken from my house, 1412 01:34:20,666 --> 01:34:24,041 my computer, my data, my newspaper, 1413 01:34:24,041 --> 01:34:30,083 My memorandum that I shared with my friends, 1414 01:34:30,083 --> 01:34:33,083 I just can't believe 1415 01:34:33,083 --> 01:34:37,166 that I am considered an enemy 1416 01:34:37,166 --> 01:34:39,000 by my own country. 1417 01:34:39,000 --> 01:34:42,666 I think - I keep thinking if this happens to us, 1418 01:34:42,666 --> 01:34:45,583 and we are educated people, 1419 01:34:45,583 --> 01:34:49,250 sophisticated in governmental ways, 1420 01:34:49,250 --> 01:34:52,125 who can get help, 1421 01:34:52,125 --> 01:34:55,333 what happens to men on the street? 1422 01:34:55,333 --> 01:34:58,791 What happened to that 18-year-old child? 1423 01:35:33,041 --> 01:35:37,250 [Binney] When I find it all 1424 01:35:33,041 --> 01:35:37,250 the things we do 1425 01:35:37,250 --> 01:35:40,250 as a result of 9/11, 1426 01:35:40,250 --> 01:35:44,416 and I heard Vice President Cheney's statement about, 1427 01:35:44,416 --> 01:35:46,500 "We have to go to the dark side," 1428 01:35:46,500 --> 01:35:50,708 I have seen it as total destruction 1429 01:35:46,500 --> 01:35:50,708 our society, 1430 01:35:50,708 --> 01:35:53,333 and we lose all moral positions in the world 1431 01:35:53,333 --> 01:35:57,041 as a result of going to the dark side. 1432 01:35:59,708 --> 01:36:01,708 That is only sa